Plasma Ignition | Plasma Jet Ignition

[Ron Hammar]

Aaron,
I just got the book down loaded and in reading it I want to ask you some questions.
Are there any one that is running a car with this system on it?
Also are you thinking about selling a kit that would be something that could be put on a car or a generator system for a house?
Also have you ran water with this or used water & gas together?
Have you found that the spark plugs have a short life with the Plazma spark?

[Aaron Murakami]

plasma ignition

Aaron,
I just got the book down loaded and in reading it I want to ask you some questions.
Are there any one that is running a car with this system on it?
Also are you thinking about selling a kit that would be something that could be put on a car or a generator system for a house?
Also have you ran water with this or used water & gas together?
Have you found that the spark plugs have a short life with the Plazma spark?

Hi Ron,

Did you see my jet engine video in the package? I have it in the video presentation.

Yes, 5-6 people that I know of running their car on the plasma.

I'm more interested in making the info avail than making kits but I'm open to it.

Plugs will have shorter life. Krupa plugs should last longer and anything tungsten should last longer.

[ThankyouBedini]

The last few post has been lots of good information. Thank you Aaron and Willem for you good work.
I got the sparks to work and it has been a fun. For sure it is better to have caps in parallel, series is to long charge and discharge time. My run caps are 1800 vdc and 4 uf. On my Land Cruiser I have the Murakami Ignition Method installed. I have a 4# ground from the top to the body and a ground # 4/0 from the top to the battery and a ground from the battery to the body. That seem to work very well.
Willem I can not wait to learn more about your booster cap adventure!

The video is an experiment I did some time ago. Guess you can call it splitting the positive.

[Willem Coetzee]

Love your Vids ThankyouBedini!

My booster cap system was built into a container to piggy-back with the distributor ignition of carburetor 1.4 Fiat Uno. Its just a high frequency DC cap charger, with 30kV diode string protection built in on the (+) cap output.

But in hindsight I believe that I stuffed up the cap (-) output, and thus its true plasma potential.

For some reason I made the cap (-) output common with charge circuit's (-) that connects onto the battery (-). That implicates that the (-) cap output had to run with the battery (-) ground wire to the engine, and only then had that (-) output a path back to the spark plug basis... that's such a unnecessary very longer route!

Although the (+) cap output was in parallel on the spark plugs with the HV (+) normal ignition output, and would have caused some plasma amplification, the fact that the (-) cap output was not directly grounded on the engine, that instant "negative resistance" path from the spark gap, over the engine, over the battery ground, back to the booster's (-) cap output might have been way too long.

Now I realize its also the same for my car as it is for Mika's RX-8.... the answer always is: Connect booster (-) output as close as possible to the spark plugs.

Another dumb question: how do I upload a diagram or photo into this thread for you guys to see?

[Scorch]

Plasma jet plug adapter?

Hello All.

One of the things Aaron mentioned in 'ignition secrets' was a "plasma jet" which is a plasma arc chamber with a hole or "jet" from which the plasma 'jets' out.
This reminded me of an old mechanics trick for dealing with worn out piston rings causing oil fouled spark plugs.

It's an adapter placed between the plug and combustion chamber called a "Non fouler" which I believe may be used to create a plasma jet and/or help protect our plugs under these high power ignition conditions.
And looks like this-
http://www.willysjeepparts.com/galle...NON-FOULER.JPG

And available from auto parts sources such as this-
www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000BYD9Z8/

I am only just recently starting to explore these alternative ignition system ideas and have not read through this entire thread so please forgive me if this non fouler adapter idea has already been suggested.

It is possible an off-the-shelf non fouler may have a hole that is to big but I believe this is worth investigation.
And of course; it wouldn't take much to use a flat washer to reduce hole size or simply weld the hole shut and drill whatever size jet you desire.

Kindest regards;

}:>

[Aaron Murakami]

how do I upload a diagram or photo into this thread for you guys to see?

At the top of your message edit box, there is a little icon 3 to the right of the smilie face that looks like a picture of a tree in a frame.
Click that and you can either upload it or give a URL where it is at.

[Aaron Murakami]

I have tried that but the cavity in the non-foulers is way to big to build any pressure unless there are monster blasts that would destroy the plug too quick.

If someone machined one precisely for this purpose, I believe any non-resistor plug could be turned into a plasma jet igniter.

Hello All.

One of the things Aaron mentioned in 'ignition secrets' was a "plasma jet" which is a plasma arc chamber with a hole or "jet" from which the plasma 'jets' out.
This reminded me of an old mechanics trick for dealing with worn out piston rings causing oil fouled spark plugs.

It's an adapter placed between the plug and combustion chamber called a "Non fouler" which I believe may be used to create a plasma jet and/or help protect our plugs under these high power ignition conditions.
And looks like this-
www.willysjeepparts.com/gallery2/d/17760-4/SPARK%20PLUG%20NON-FOULER.JPG

And available from auto parts sources such as this-
www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000BYD9Z8/

I am only just recently starting to explore these alternative ignition system ideas and have not read through this entire thread so please forgive me if this non fouler adapter idea has already been suggested.

It is possible an off-the-shelf non fouler may have a hole that is to big but I believe this is worth investigation.
And of course; it wouldn't take much to use a flat washer to reduce hole size or simply weld the hole shut and drill whatever size jet you desire.

Kindest regards;

}:>

[dowens]

Aaron, I got everything I needed we had talked about for the non-fouler plug. Have to play with the ceramic I have and figure a couple things out. Not too much longer, need some facilities real quick. Also, I'm modifying a few champions and will post up a youtube vid if interested. Looking at ebay on those as well. Peace!!

[Scorch]

Hey Aaron.

I thought this might be the case but maybe it could still be useful for something as it is a ready made collar that fits spark plug and may serve as a base part to start with.
Of course if somebody is going to perform a lot of machining; they might as well work off of Stanley Meyer's design and just go from there.

In the meantime; I am still just learning some of these things while also trying to ignore a particular classical physicist who keeps screaming in my ear "I KNOW it's impossible so don't even try"...
I guess he hasn't heard or decided to ignore that classical physics already confirmed (over 100+ years ago) that it actually is possible.
http://www.tuks.nl/pdf/Reference_Mat...20-%202000.pdf

And I just spent this afternoon rebuilding the old 555 timer / relay experiment that I had bench tested many years ago when I first saw it appear on youtube.
(See attached)

I always like having something portable I can take on the road to show others at parties or whatever, so I rebuilt this old experiment now that I am a lot more interested in learning these possibilities and maybe teach a few things to others.

After giving up on another path I was following; I finally decided to pursue some of the interesting things happening with HHO systems.
See:
www.furaffinity.net/view/16271821/
www.furaffinity.net/view/16339030/

Only to discover I may not even have to go to all that trouble to build such things and I am a LOT more interested in what can be done with these plasma methods for DIRECT dissociation of water per the many new paradigm ideas as presented by Dr. Moray King.

So this is where I am at this point.

I do have the test bed engine and I am in the process of fabricating a new 2:1 geared timing system and plan to explore some of these plasma ignition possibilities before I even bother working with HHO systems.
But I do have an interesting idea for HHO. Has anybody ever considered mounting their HHO cell directly on the engine so that engine vibration helps to increase cavitation and keep bubbles moving off of the plates similar to the way Mr. Ohmasa's system works?

Just a thought anyway. If you review those videos of the Anton cell and generator operating in an elevator; he has his engine and cell on a lightweight cart that is vibrating so much that the halogen bulb fails....
This could very well be one of the 'secrets' to higher HHO output. Vibrate that cell!

And maybe even mount the cell in such a manor to be able to 'tune' for best resonance simply by rotating and moving cell up and down a spring steel 'tuning fork' type of mount bolted directly to the engine.
This should work REALLY well on single cylinder engines...

Kindest regards;

}:>

I have tried that but the cavity in the non-foulers is way to big to build any pressure unless there are monster blasts that would destroy the plug too quick.

If someone machined one precisely for this purpose, I believe any non-resistor plug could be turned into a plasma jet igniter.

[Willem Coetzee]

At the top of your message edit box, there is a little icon 3 to the right of the smilie face that looks like a picture of a tree in a frame.
Click that and you can either upload it or give a URL where it is at.

THANK YOU AARON !!!

Now to get my drawing & photography skills up to standard to communicate correctly and stop wasting this thread's valuable space by my clumsy communication.

Just for a "proof of concept connection" I want to piggy-back my amp onto my standard waste spark ignition. Because the Coils are isolation coils, the HV (+) for each pare of spark plugs can connect in parallel to each plug in the pare, and the booster (+) output paralleled on the spark plug center electrodes... I understand your well presented diagrams on THAT.

But with the coil pack HV (-) output and the booster cap (-) output both grounded onto the engine head, say, central to all 4 spark plugs...

1) might the cap (-) output flow backwards from the booster into that HV (-) wire into the secondary winding of the coil pack?
2) might the HV (-) output flow into the LV (-) cap output along the wire into the booster?

In both cases I hope that the HV (+) event in the gap will be enough to make both above mentioned worries, an impossibility. But I would like some logic and wisdom regarding this, so i can just do the connection, and move on to something like ionizing the intake air.

[Scorch]

Iinteresting Reference Links

Hello All.

I don't know if these may already be mentioned in this thread but I just discovered a couple related links I found to be pretty interesting and may be useful for some of you.

Some very unique spark plug designs from a Chinese manufacturer-
www.liben-parts.com/index_en.asp
Make sure to check out "XFire 2G iridium" and some of the designs have an orifice in the ground terminal reminiscent of David's "Sonic Spark Plug" ( www.enginebrain.com )

An archive of interesting documents related to water fuels, plasma arc ignition systems and various other stuff-
www.tuks.nl
Allows directory listings such as: http://www.tuks.nl/pdf/Reference_Mat...ric_Breakdown/ so have fun exploring the documents.

Hope that helps.

Kindest regards;

}:>

[Scorch]

Video - Scorch's Custom Ignition Timing System and TDC Procedure.

Hello all.

I just produced a short video detailing my custom fabricated timing system I intend to use with an MSD controlled plasma ignition system on a generator.

PS: I posted a message here a couple days ago regarding some very unique spark plug designs I discovered along with a link to a related document archive but then there was this message saying something to the extent of: "will be posted after review". Not sure what that's all about and my post still hasn't come through for some reason which is very frustrating...
(I hope it's not lost because I did not save a local copy after all my work authoring it for the benefit of this thread...)

That is all for now and hope to complete more fabrication this weekend so stay tuned.

Kindest regards;

}:>

[Aaron Murakami]

Aaron, I got everything I needed we had talked about for the non-fouler plug. Have to play with the ceramic I have and figure a couple things out. Not too much longer, need some facilities real quick. Also, I'm modifying a few champions and will post up a youtube vid if interested. Looking at ebay on those as well. Peace!!

Yes, definitely would love to see your work!

[Aaron Murakami]

conditioned tubes

Hey Aaron.

I thought this might be the case but maybe it could still be useful for something as it is a ready made collar that fits spark plug and may serve as a base part to start with.
Of course if somebody is going to perform a lot of machining; they might as well work off of Stanley Meyer's design and just go from there.

In the meantime; I am still just learning some of these things while also trying to ignore a particular classical physicist who keeps screaming in my ear "I KNOW it's impossible so don't even try"...
I guess he hasn't heard or decided to ignore that classical physics already confirmed (over 100+ years ago) that it actually is possible.
http://www.tuks.nl/pdf/Reference_Mat...20-%202000.pdf

And I just spent this afternoon rebuilding the old 555 timer / relay experiment that I had bench tested many years ago when I first saw it appear on youtube.
(See attached)

I always like having something portable I can take on the road to show others at parties or whatever, so I rebuilt this old experiment now that I am a lot more interested in learning these possibilities and maybe teach a few things to others.

After giving up on another path I was following; I finally decided to pursue some of the interesting things happening with HHO systems.
See:
www.furaffinity.net/view/16271821/
www.furaffinity.net/view/16339030/

Only to discover I may not even have to go to all that trouble to build such things and I am a LOT more interested in what can be done with these plasma methods for DIRECT dissociation of water per the many new paradigm ideas as presented by Dr. Moray King.

So this is where I am at this point.

I do have the test bed engine and I am in the process of fabricating a new 2:1 geared timing system and plan to explore some of these plasma ignition possibilities before I even bother working with HHO systems.
But I do have an interesting idea for HHO. Has anybody ever considered mounting their HHO cell directly on the engine so that engine vibration helps to increase cavitation and keep bubbles moving off of the plates similar to the way Mr. Ohmasa's system works?

Just a thought anyway. If you review those videos of the Anton cell and generator operating in an elevator; he has his engine and cell on a lightweight cart that is vibrating so much that the halogen bulb fails....
This could very well be one of the 'secrets' to higher HHO output. Vibrate that cell!

And maybe even mount the cell in such a manor to be able to 'tune' for best resonance simply by rotating and moving cell up and down a spring steel 'tuning fork' type of mount bolted directly to the engine.
This should work REALLY well on single cylinder engines...

Kindest regards;

}:>

That's a nice looking demo unit with the relay!

The non foulers might indeed be able to be used as a starting block. Might be more of what needs to be filled in than what is taken out to shrink that cavity.

With Meyer's - his water injector plugs - they were never able to get them to work. Only the water cell method worked.

The Graneau work is exceptional. I wish he were still alive to continue his water explosion work. He was using some very high joule discharges that wouldn't work in an engine because it would destroy it, but he was able to explode small amounts of water with such force that the water shot through pieces of aluminum!

I saw one Moray King demo on the vibrating cell from the Japanese researched. Jeane Manning is who turned me on to it. Simple enough and I believe the researcher even said you can use an off center flywheel to give the vibration. I don't know if cavitation is actually happening with these vibrations and if that attributes to extra production or if the vibration actually just helps to free the bubbles from the plates. In any case, it's simple and low power enough to vibrate the cell so might as well do it.

With concentric tube cells, with enough production, the gas is forced to carry any bubbles off the tube surface as it goes up towards the top. I was able to produce a lot of gas for low input with "conditioned" tubes and just pulsing a variac through a choke to the tubes.

Here's the conditioning:

[Aaron Murakami]

hho concentric cell test

Here's the gas production - more gas from 1 single tube set than most people are getting from 8-10 tubes combined with all their PLL circuits, etc... they just don't get it:

You can run an engine with just water and the plasma if the plasma is big enough but it would damage the engine. Revizal was the first to show the motorcycle type engine running like that for short bursts from what I can recall.