Zero Force Motor Replication Project

[ZPDM]

Those are good questions and I don't personally have the answer but I'd encourage everyone to draw out the "superpole" configurations where like fields repel and the magnetic paths that are in attraction - along the lines of how John showed it for the SG and you might be surprised.

Lenz is definitely happening somewhere in the machine. Lines of force interaction isn't the only interaction in the machine. When you say lines of force, are you talking about electric lines of force how John described it as being distinctly different from the magnetic flux lines?

Yaro's machine is like the one that Peter built - John only provided the plans. John's original ZFMs were all 2 poles, N and S on the rotor - either single fields facing out or superpole configurations to have super N and S on opposite sides.

Hey Aaron,

I am basically just thinking of lines of force not being contained but flying off into space (like you see in a picture of a bar magnet) as important to Lenz, I got no real idea. What's worse is I have no clear imagine of how two magnetic fields are interacting (let alone super poles). By this I mean I have seen with my machines narrow coils with fewer winds that are more efficient than larger coils with much greater inductance. How do the gears fit together, real mind bender with something like the presentation ZFM. I need to focus primarily on other things than experimenting now but the two experiments on the back burners are 1) returning to the ZFM to see how to arrange coils (and bifilar coils) 2) discharging a cap into a coil and measuring radiant. I looked again at my spreadsheet and am not sure that improvements in efficiency slow as voltage increases. They may drop off up to about 60-80 volts then hold steady to 240 volts. Need to throw together a joule thief or other transformer and run up to 720V or whatever the cap can handle. Should give me my answer. Tesla wasn't opposed to either high voltage or large coils, might not be the worst direction to move in even if my theory is lacking. As an aside, how could an EMP from hundreds of miles away be expected to do so much damage if the effects weren't OU. Now someone just tell me why they keep blotting out the sun every other day with garbage from planes, again no idea but it seems it has to be some sort of arms race thing likely related to electromagnetic over the horizon effects. Equally likely a low level government regulator decided flouride in jet fuel would prevent cavities in trees and it was adopted world wide without further discussion.

[Aaron Murakami]

This is relevant to the ZFM: http://www.energyscienceforum.com/sh...ll=1#post26229 - please read the post.

[DMANN]

I can do a ZFM attachment for the middle of this if anyone is interested. Just give me some idea or dimensions you would like to see for the coil holders and rotor/mags.

DMann

[DMANN]

The Zero Force Motor Attachment was added to Thingiverse: http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2149756 This part should replace the window motor parts in the middle of :http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2149044 The rotor is 2.5". It is made for 3/4" X 1/4" disc magnets.



Enjoy
DMann

[Yaro1776]

The Zero Force Motor Attachment was added to Thingiverse: http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2149756 This part should replace the window motor parts in the middle of :http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2149044 The rotor is 2.5". It is made for 3/4" X 1/4" disc magnets.


[ATTACH=CONFIG]6128[/ATTACH][ATTACH=CONFIG]6129[/ATTACH]
Enjoy
DMann

DMann - good looking design that should work well. What are you recommending for retaining the Neo's in position in the rotor?

Thanks to you for the 3D effort,
Yaro

[DMANN]

Hey Yaro. A light amount of high expansion glue such as original gorrila glue should work just fine. I don't use anything though. It is a tight fit with my print settings.

Mann

[Aaron Murakami]

Hey Yaro. A light amount of high expansion glue such as original gorrila glue should work just fine. I don't use anything though. It is a tight fit with my print settings.

Mann

Those are great - what about some cutouts in the rotor to insert iron slugs? The way you have the slot of the magnet, if you made a T where the perpendicular cutout goes from the magnet towards the shaft, it would perform as an iron keeper, which is what John always used. It would also add a bit more weight to the rotor for some flywheel effect.

@All, might find that coils that are longer than 90 degrees might wind up being optimum. If it is for producing more torque, power would be on longer but is required to push/pull the rotor for longer. I have no idea if anything other than 90 degrees would work well or not but is worth asking the question.

[AlvaroHN]

I am always afraid of flying magnets, on my machine which has a small rotor 10 cm diameter, 3,9 inches diameter, what I have is a plastic circle around the rotor, I cutted a strip of a coca cola large bottle, and then placed it on the rotor all around, then with a lighter from below I gave it a little heat so the plastic shrinks to the rotor size.

[DMANN]

I added this revised ZFM rotor to the file. It is a bit more complex. But I think it will give you what you are looking for. Thanks for the suggestions.

http://www.magnet4less.com/product_i...oducts_id=1023
or
http://www.magnet4less.com/product_i...oducts_id=1264

Both will take a #6 bolt. I made the hole toward the shaft .6" so a .5" long bolt should work.
Added the slots for balancing. They will fit the .75" X .25" mags as well if you want to experiment with that.

Enjoy
Mann

[Deuis]

Hi AlvaroHN,

There is a product I use here in Australia, its glue lined heatshrink.
It wont be see through, but it will certainly hold what you want into place.
Depending where you buy it from it has various sizes and wall thicknesses.
Slip it over your rotor, heat with heat gun and the heatshrink pushes the glue around while it shrinks.
This stuff is tough as nails.

https://www.voltexelectrical.com.au/...at-Shrink.aspx

I am always afraid of flying magnets, on my machine which has a small rotor 10 cm diameter, 3,9 inches diameter, what I have is a plastic circle around the rotor, I cutted a strip of a coca cola large bottle, and then placed it on the rotor all around, then with a lighter from below I gave it a little heat so the plastic shrinks to the rotor size.

[Aaron Murakami]

I added this revised ZFM rotor to the file. It is a bit more complex. But I think it will give you what you are looking for. Thanks for the suggestions.

http://www.magnet4less.com/product_i...oducts_id=1023
or
http://www.magnet4less.com/product_i...oducts_id=1264

Both will take a #6 bolt. I made the hole toward the shaft .6" so a .5" long bolt should work.
Added the slots for balancing. They will fit the .75" X .25" mags as well if you want to experiment with that.

Enjoy
Mann

Hi Mann,

That's almost it - if you lave the magnet holes like that, but rotate the keeper holes 45 degrees so they actually make a T with the magnets, then the iron pieces will literally hold the magnet field from the magnet face on the axle side. I don't know if there are simple iron pieces of standard sizes that can be put in but this is the idea anyway. The model Peter built had the square iron with magnets on each of the 4 sides and Bedini's original ZFM's all had an iron keeper with 2 magnets 180 degrees from each other, but in all cases, the magnets were intended to have an iron keeper. Although in the 3D print idea, the axle end of the magnet keepers won't physically touch, they're still providing a path for the magnetic flux.

[DMANN]

Hi Mann,

That's almost it - if you lave the magnet holes like that, but rotate the keeper holes 45 degrees so they actually make a T with the magnets, then the iron pieces will literally hold the magnet field from the magnet face on the axle side. I don't know if there are simple iron pieces of standard sizes that can be put in but this is the idea anyway. The model Peter built had the square iron with magnets on each of the 4 sides and Bedini's original ZFM's all had an iron keeper with 2 magnets 180 degrees from each other, but in all cases, the magnets were intended to have an iron keeper. Although in the 3D print idea, the axle end of the magnet keepers won't physically touch, they're still providing a path for the magnetic flux.

Can you illustrate what you are describing? This is what I was thinking and what I did on the Window Motor rotor.

[Aaron Murakami]

Can you illustrate what you are describing? This is what I was thinking and what I did on the Window Motor rotor.

What you just drew there is interesting - those inside magnets might actually retain the flux like an iron keeper since it pulls in the bottom facing field of the outside magnets, which is part of the point to the keeper. But not sure of how some of the coil flux will be diverted through the rotor.

Here is what I was meaning:



Of course like I mentioned, not sure if there are standard size little iron stock pieces that can be inserted into some standard sized slot. Maybe stacks of washers or something as long as they're magnetic.

[Yaro1776]

What you just drew there is interesting - those inside magnets might actually retain the flux like an iron keeper since it pulls in the bottom facing field of the outside magnets, which is part of the point to the keeper. But not sure of how some of the coil flux will be diverted through the rotor.

Of course like I mentioned, not sure if there are standard size little iron stock pieces that can be inserted into some standard sized slot. Maybe stacks of washers or something as long as they're magnetic.

Readily available square key stock from the usual suppliers (McMaster, Grainger, etc) that will work...
Yaro

[DMANN]

Readily available square key stock from the usual suppliers (McMaster, Grainger, etc) that will work...
Yaro

I'm thinking 5/8" round stock. I can expand the magnet set screw hole up to 5/8" to be used for the iron piece. Another option would be just to make a slot for a bigger magnet. A 3/4" X 3/4" cylinder magnet would fit. I can design whatever just let me know. It will be Monday night before I will be able to do anything. If you draw a design on paper and post a pic, I can see what you are describing. If everyone agrees on the "T" I will do that, but understand that you will only be able to fit about a 3/4" X 1/2" piece of iron in that spot.

Mann