Zero Force Motor Replication Project

[Aaron Murakami]

Hi Davy, I can see them here: http://www.energyscienceforum.com/sh...7097#post27097

John K.

I think because you have moderator status. That is how it came up for me and did not notice that it was flagged for moderation somehow.

[Aaron Murakami]

Thanks for your reply Aaron.

"Approval isn't required for any member to post.
I simply gave you my opinion on the notes as a reply to your post."

That has been my experience in the past, but yesterday it flashed on screen "waiting to be approved by moderator" and I still don't see it listed anywhere on the main bedini forum thread list, so if you have replied, can you please share a link for me here so I can find it?

When I replied, it looked like a regular post that everyone could see. That was the whole reason I replied to it.

I found that in front, it did say moderated, so I approved it.

I have no idea why once in a blue moon a post will require moderation - might be the quantity of images or something.

[Gyula]

Davy, try this one: http://www.energyscienceforum.com/showthread.php?t=3863

John K.

Hi John,

This new link you kindly included does not work either. I get the same error message Davy quoted above, cannot see Davy's posts in question.

thanks for trying to help.

Gyula

[John_Koorn]

John K, when I click it, I get :
"Invalid Thread specified. If you followed a valid link, please notify the administrator"

Davy, try this one: http://www.energyscienceforum.com/showthread.php?t=3863

John K.

[Davy Oneness]

John K, when I click it, I get :
"Invalid Thread specified. If you followed a valid link, please notify the administrator"

[John_Koorn]

Thanks for your reply Aaron.

"Approval isn't required for any member to post.
I simply gave you my opinion on the notes as a reply to your post."

That has been my experience in the past, but yesterday it flashed on screen "waiting to be approved by moderator" and I still don't see it listed anywhere on the main bedini forum thread list, so if you have replied, can you please share a link for me here so I can find it?

Hi Davy, I can see them here: http://www.energyscienceforum.com/sh...7097#post27097

John K.

[Davy Oneness]

Thanks for your reply Aaron.

"Approval isn't required for any member to post.
I simply gave you my opinion on the notes as a reply to your post."

That has been my experience in the past, but yesterday it flashed on screen "waiting to be approved by moderator" and I still don't see it listed anywhere on the main bedini forum thread list, so if you have replied, can you please share a link for me here so I can find it?

[Aaron Murakami]

Thank you Yaro for your presentation, I watched it the other night. I posted more pages of notes people didn't seem to have yesterday , but seems board moderator doesn't want to approve my post so you can all see them ...............not sure if you will even see this one telling you about it! ....wtf......

Approval isn't required for any member to post.

I simply gave you my opinion on the notes as a reply to your post.

[Davy Oneness]

Thank you Yaro for your presentation, I watched it the other night. I posted more pages of notes people didn't seem to have yesterday , but seems board moderator doesn't want to approve my post so you can all see them ...............not sure if you will even see this one telling you about it! ....wtf......

[James McDonald]

Thank you for the details, James. I will get the e-book. What is the epoxy type? Have you noticed the bearings getting warm after longer runs? If you know the temperature rise and the weight of the bearings we could figure that loss in our efficiency calculations.
From two videos I have seen so far they show 56% efficiency and 76% efficiency. That's disappointing considering it's the same range as any other motor. Does someone expect it to be possible to exceed COP>1 with the ZFM with more tweeking? If so, based on what information? What makes this motor particularly interesting?

Hi Richard --

The epoxy type is "Loctite 334" which is a high strength epoxy designed specifically for applications in securing magnets.
http://na.henkel-adhesives.com/produ...=8797886152705
I have not noticed any bearing heat up even after an 1 hour run of the Zero Force Motor. This may be due to the size and type
of bearings they are and how they are cased in a metal holder. While the Zero Force Motor is running cold air is being blown
out of the front of my Zero Force Motor build. Everything that I touch around the motor is either colder then room temperature
or just a little above room temperature. It depends on how far the part you are taking a temperature reading off of is from the stream of cold air coming from the motor. I do not know about these videos on other builds of the Zero Force Motor. To date there has been only two Zero Force Motor builds acknowledged as good replications of the Bedini Zero Force Motor. Please provide the links to these videos. I also would like to know what input voltage these two motors were running on and at what RPM did they max out at? As to date I have run my motor at an input voltage of 50 volts DC and Yaro has run his motor at a 60 volt DC input. The RPM of the machine did not increase much from 50 volts to 60 volts and this may be because of the switching speed of the reeds. They are switching On and Off so fast that they become almost steady On at these high RPM's. So some improvements can be made here by switching out reed switches to a more digital type input whether it be Hall sensors or a total different approach not using magnets and going with an input PWM pulse from a Micro-controller. I am not going to speculate on a COP>1 at this point in time since no true brake testing has been done on any of the three Zero Force Motor replications. To answer your last question you may have to do a lot of research on this if you do not believe the answer. The Zero Force Motor is modeled around the way the Earth itself operates. The magnetic fields of the motor are the same as the magnetic fields of the Earth itself. This is what makes this motor particularly interesting.

-- James

[James McDonald]

Sure, James.
If you would like to help me out I would like to build the motor. Can you recommend the best source for plans? And if you recommend a source of plans for me, are those the plans you followed? Any deviations? What is your shaft diameter? If I can duplicate yours exactly, it would make comparisons and note comparing easier. If anyone has a few extra bucks (I don't at the moment) ceramic bearings are nice; over $100 each.

Hi Richard --

You can purchase the video of the ZFM presentation and all the notes of the presentation along with a compiled PDF book
from Aaron's website. The PDF book and the PDF slides are the easiest way to get all the information to build a ZFM without going
through this ZFM thread and taking notes of all the details. I will tell you that I did change a two things and now I have to change a
third item because of one of the changes I made to the design. The coil on the original ZFM which has two sides that measure 2.5 ohms each. These two coils of wire have two 75 to 80 foot of AWG 20 magnet wire on each side. So each side will have 2 coils. This is the first thing that I changed and this change has caused me to change another item due to the ZFM has to have matching components. The change I made was to make each side 3 ohms of wire but my wire was AWG 18 magnet wire single strand. By doing this since the wire size is bigger and the ohms per foot of wire is less so you need 450 foot of AWG 18 magnet wire to make 3 ohms. So both sides of the toroid shaped coil is 450 foot of wire making the series resistance 6.0 ohms. By doing this the coil becomes thicker and wider. The magnets have to be stronger and bigger to cut through all those wires. The original ZFM has a round magnet size of N42 1 inch wide by 3/8 inch thick. My magnet is a magnet of the similar size to an SG machine magnet which in this case is a N52 2 inches long by 1 inch wide by 1/2 inch thick. My shaft size is 0.499 inches. The original shaft size is 0.375. My rotor is 2 inches long and around 1.5 inches wide with radius corners. It is made from 99.5% pure iron. The original rotor is magnetic steel or iron mixed cube which is 1.3 inches by 1.3 inches by 1.0 inch with radius corners. I used a 3 inch PVC pipe to mount my reed switches onto. The original used a L shaped form to mount the reed switches on at the 0 degree and 90 degree locations. This L shaped mount had some adjustment for the reeds and the mount for moving it closer to the timing wheel magnets which are mounted at 0 degrees and 180 degrees. The exact type of bearings the original has I do not know. I used Dodge pillow block bearing which are rated for 12,500 RPM. They make a better rated bearing which is rated for 14,500 RPM. The drive circuit is a Bedini Cole circuit. Since you cannot buy the BJT audio transistors used in the original ZFM you can use the SG machine BJT transistor with its companion PNP transistor. I used a higher grade transistor above the ones used in the SG machine with it's companion PNP transistor. The original has all this mounted on Plexiglas and I have mounted all my items on wood. The biggest thing you need to pay attention to is the mounting of the bearings. The mounting of the bearing has to be machined so they do not bind. The pillow block bearings allow you to make manual adjustments which is the easy way to get a ZFM setup going but they are a pain to adjust. One other detail is you must buy an epoxy that can hold the magnets onto the rotor at speeds up to 15,000 RPM.

-- James

[Aaron Murakami]

This is a simple and inexpensive way to get a pretty good read for these projects:

[James McDonald]

Too bad you are not in the Lost Angeles area. I would like to help set up a torque testing brake since you have already done most of the work. Besides car brakes there are some nice bicycle disk brake systems that could be adapted for the smaller applications.
I wonder if there is anyone near me doing this type of work and might be interested in some help.

Hi Richard --

Maybe once we are ready to do this torque test you could give us a few ways to do it and tell us what to buy so
we can get good measurement data. As far as I know only two of us have done a true replication of the original Zero
Force Motor. I am in Maryland and the other guy is in Vermont. We had all three Zero Force Motors lined up in the Vendor
room at the 2017 Energy & Technology Conference. You missed a good conference.

-- James

[James McDonald]

Thank you, James.
I was at the 2016 Conference and had the great privilege of meeting John Bedini. I was unable to attend this year, unfortunately.
Based on your experience and understanding of this motor would you consider it realistic to test it with a brake applied to the shaft with a torque measuring device to indicate torque and rpm information while monitoring the input wattage to determine efficiency/COP? And if so, would you expect COP>1 with a properly built ZFM?

Using;
HP=(2PIxft/lbxrpm)÷33000 and 746 watts per horsepower @ 100% efficiency

Hi Richard --

Since I do not own a torque testing brake it would be hard for me to get this information to properly calculate the Horse Power of a Zero Force Motor with the same formula that Engineer James Watt used to calculate the horse power of steam engines. I wish I could do a real torque test other then putting my fingers on the shaft to slow down the motor and record the current but that would not tell me the foot pounds of force applied. What I can tell you is the Zero Force Motor draws very little current when running at speed. That current increases as force is applied to the shaft but when the force is release the Zero Force Motor quickly goes back to the maximum speed for the input voltage applied and back to the original current draw on the power source. Since this motor coil has no iron core in the toroid shaped coil it is run by makes it is a very unique motor. I am currently going to do another experiment this weekend that should increase the torque of my Zero Force Motor. What I can tell you is the size and strength of the magnets used to going to have a big impact on the torque the motor has. Until I can do I real torque test with a torque testing brake I would be only guessing if the motor would reach 100% efficiency.

-- James

[Deuis]

If your trying to understand why a Lenzless motor would be useful watch Peter lindemanns motor secrets 1. He details the maths and practical aspects.