Off the grid with Bedini Tech

[acad14n]

3 You can use muilty strand SSG based circuits that apply their output to a cap pulser circuit that's charging 4+ battery banks, and then use those battery's to run cap pulsed based or SSG energizers, to charge other battery banks....

You mean all branches charging a common capacitor, or each branch charging a capacitor?

[RS_]

each coil branch/strand/ or several sg /ssg coils or genny coils charging a common cap, and discharged into a bank of 4 battery's

[John_Koorn]

JOHN K said he could not get it to work as well because he has not had the time so I think it is time that someone try this SSSG.


Mikey

When did I say that? Can you quote me please?

Mikey, I've probably blown up more SSSG's than you've built so don't say I haven't had the time. I've never had a SSSG give me better results than a rotored SG.

There is a darn good reason why JB spins magnets.

John K.

[BobZilla]

Mikey,
I do not want to make arguments with you but you keep saying things that should be examined.

Your refusal to try a wheel is silly. You have spent countless hours trying to master this technology and you are leaving a good half of the knowledge and potential experience on the table. Haven't you learned with your own experiments yet that very often things that you may assume do not actually work out in practice, I know I have been surprised many times when I thought something would work one way and find out it does not.

A wheel is not needed. A solid State Version is trhe same as the wheel stuck in self oscillation so get off it Tom C.

Don't presume to think you already know because you do not. You also seem to think you are the only one to make a solid state version, again you are not. I have made MANY from small to large and I can tell you without any reservation that they do not work the same as a wheel. Look at the circuit for gods sake. Look at your trigger source when you go SS and compare that to a rotor version, notice anything?

Now as too which is better, I'm not going to say one over the other but I am saying that they are NOT the same thing. I like both for different reasons.

I am able to easily charge a 100ah battery bank over night on 2.2 amps 13volts with this solid state version so that's good enough for me when most other small units are only doing a 13amp hours battery as per JB instruction for the bike wheel.

First you said it was 300+AH, now 100? Ok I can accept it either way but that is a big difference. Can you do it without using the charger? That is the biggest thing of it all here to me. Don't want a wheel, fine but if you cannot go around telling people how great your SS runs if you plug it into a wall and use your primary as a pass through capacitor. 13V huh, well my primary will drop under load way below that even fully charged, especially pulling over 2A. Focus on this aspect man. Charge your primary up and put it on the machine, do not feed it anything for an entire run and see where you can push your charge battery too.

By the way I have pulled my SS out and started playing with it again. I will be posting some results soon. I stripped all of the wacky stuff off of it and put it back to a "normal" setup and added a cap dump. Just a plain SS with cap dump.

[RS_]

Mikey,


The solid state SSG is Not the same as a rotored SSG they have very different triggering caricaturistic's and in my experience the rotored versions work much better, and JB has said this Many Many times......

when you add a cap dump to a SSG, rotored or not, it changes the way things work as the SSG circuit is now seeing a cap vs Batterys,........ this is regaging the energy from high V almost current less spikes, to a low voltage fast thump of voltage with a lot more current and a very much slower pulse train into the battery, which the batterys like better.......

if you have 5 batterys that are all real close to being the same amp hour in size, take your SSSSG with cap dump, and one fully charged battery as the primary, and the other 4 that have been run down to 12V under load, then charge the 4 batterys with the one primary till it gets down to 12V while measuring the current and V as the battery runs down, for how much joules you put in, then no matter how much the 4 charging batterys have charged, run them down to 12V under load and measure the current and voltage as they run down to get a out put measurement, on all 4 then add them up and compare to how much joules went in for your cop.......

then if you have a solar big enough to charge the primary and run the SSSSG circuit, use it to make up any difference in fully charging the 4 secondary battery's......

[RS_]

oop's made a double post..................................

[Tom C]

Do you really think that buttering my bread at the end of a rant where you tell me I am full of **** is really going to do any good? what a box of rocks!!

Do whatever you want mike I no longer care, please do not disparage this group to others and whine because we wont divulge "secrets" that are not there. I am more than willing to share what I have done as long as someone is willing to think outside the box, even the box he has built for himself. I don't care what any of the others say. I would not be doing this and putting up with this crap from people like you if it did not work and I did not care.

if you are cop greater than 1 its all you need and you have the answer, you will never know it until you unplug from the wall. so have a good one I wont be responding to you anymore. this is the second time you have called into question my knowledge, character and instructions.

almost all the mods I have DONT work with a solid state SG, and I am not going to tell you something that WONT work on solid state.... think about it, really think about it why???????????????????????????????????


its like when you tell your teenager to go clean his room and he wont do it, just because he sees no reason to do it, and he is old enough you cant make him, and some other kid told him his dad does not make him either. but what you don't tell him is there is a set of car keys tucked under his pile of crap in a big red box, and you only want him to clean his room so he can find it and you can give him the car that you two restored together. so tell your MIB friends that I wont be spoon feeding info to you so can tell them and shut me down like they did JB and so many others. you just lost the keys.

Good bye, you may continue to post here but please do not ask me any more questions I will not answer you.

have a good one, build a wheel do the work, do the mods get off the grid....

Tom C

[BobZilla]

Apologies to everyone reading this thread who are interested in OFF-GRID technology, we have side tracked on the topic.

With that said I have a few serious questions regarding Solar setups. As I previously mentioned I am very interested in getting some kind of off-grid system going. I already know that I would not choose any controller other than Mr. Bedini's solar tracker, five I think is available now but perhaps a model three. I am not really too clear on the differences and it may have already gone over but I would like to ask again a few things.

With a tracker is it true that you can have it connected to a battery bank and run an SSG simultaneously assuming you have enough power coming in from the panels to supply both? Maybe it is better to have more batteries to charge and not run a machine with extra voltage, harvest all you can into storage and run the machine from that at a later time. Perhaps those of you who already run trackers could share how your setups are configured?

On the panels, a general question. Is it better to have say two smaller panels or one larger of equivalent power? Example two 60watt in parallel or one 120watt. From what I have been looking at the larger panels are cheaper per watt so it would seem that is the way to go but maybe there are gains I am not considering from having multiple smaller panels.

It is obviously a large investment so I want to really understand all of the options before choosing how to build a solar storage system.

Out of the trackers what is the largest size bank that would be reasonable to expect to maintain? I know the small unit is 10A rate so would that mean the panels should provide somewhere around 10A max to the unit and if so what size bank would be appropriate for that, 12V system.

I was looking at these panels and thinking two of these would be a nice supply for a small tracker, any opinions?

http://www.ul-solar.com/UL_SOLAR_80_...tp080p-tss.htm

I know these are pretty general questions but I am just trying to pick the brains of those of you with experience in off-grid systems. I probably do not know enough to know the best questions to ask so any advise on what direction to go would be appreciated.

[Peter Murray]

Bob,

manufactures usually quote no more than 80% of the charger rating for connected panels, ie 8A of panels for a 10A tracker.
This is to give the system some slack during 'edge of cloud effect' this is where the sun passing the edge of a cloud can
and does concentrate the power of the sun on the panels.

My system has a 60A controller which under full sun conditions will produce 40A, but under cloudy/sunny days I have seen 48A
on the charge controller for very short periods.

I hope this helps

Peter

[BobZilla]

Thanks Peter I had no idea about the effect you speak of. Exactly why I am asking these questions

[BobZilla]

Mikey,

Are you trying to make me look foolish for saying that that the primary will drop well below 13v under a 2A load. If so I think once again your missing the point. I'm quite sure your 300AH bank can happily supply 2A, mine can too. That is not your primary. I'm not sure if you said what exactly your primary is but in the video it is clearly a single battery (and a wall charger). Are you suggesting that your primary can supply 13v @ 2A for 8 hours?

Again you charged your bank up in 8 hours, great but I will ask again if you did that with a supply clipped on to your primary. If you did than you have converted AC power to DC and charged your batteries with an endless constant voltage supply. If that is all you are after than you do not need anything other than that charger you are using to supply your system.

Now if you are doing it as I asked a few times and have charged the bank with ONLY the primary than that is fantastic. I hope you have had this kind of success but your video showed otherwise. I am beginning to think that you have tunnel vision on the charging side and just do not understand.

Now I did sort of poke at you about the 2.2A you run on but I will take it back. You are using big wires and it is quite possible that that is where you need to be for them but the primary has to run the system without the charger unless that is what you want of course. You have to consider that without that supply your primary is not unlimited AND that 8 or 9 hours would not be the same either. Your primary will fall down as time moves on and the system will not charge at the same rate.

You have a nice system and I am not saying you do not. I cannot get excited about a wall charger though. It reminds me of that perpetual motion machine that ran for years in a museum somewhere. Everyone was amazed at it. What they did not know was a night time maintenance man was paid to stick a key in a hidden slot every night and give it a few cranks.


As far as the SS vs a Rotor:

I am going to make a suggestion to you. Get out a pin and paper and draw out the trigger circuit for a rotor ssg. Now do the same for a solid state. Where does the "trigger" come from where is the trigger voltage on a rotor? Where is it coming from on the SS? Is there a difference, can you see it? I am not talking about just drawing it out and saying this goes here and that there, think about how this is working, follow the current path. In the SS do you really have a "trigger" at all? What again is the point of a trigger in the first place. Maybe it is more of a base driver huh?

Hi BobZ

I like the way you pick me apart KOOL. I have to go to work but soon I will share SSSG results. Yes an SG osc is not a SSG and yes I guess you got me on the term "Silly" I shouldn't do that I guess I just love to play on words and get everybody giving the right answer.

BRB for some amazing results. I charged ONE of my many banks ending voltage 15.68vdc

Now the light is running and will be forever well maybe all day.

I charged the bank overnight ONLY like 8-10 hours and when I got there it was WAAAY TO high much extra energy was put in.

I started my discharge and even with a 2 amp draw the voltage has hung at 13.5 for several minutes. after 10 minute the voltage is still 13.2vdc.

BRB I am Soooo excited to see just what RS is talking about.

RS thats and all of the guys if you guys didn't buy a $600 cap pulser from JOHN B you had better do it or make one this year.


Combination SG Osc and cap dump???? It is magic. Buy one it is worth the payOla


Mikey

[RS_]

"I started my discharge and even with a 2 amp draw the voltage has hung at 13.5 for several minutes. after 10 minute the voltage is still 13.2vdc."

cap pulser conditioned battery's, after many, many charge / discharge cycles will stand at 13V to 13.5V, and will sometimes take as long as 30 minuets to get below 13V and as long as 2 hours to get below 12.9V under load, and this is a good thing......

so if your primary is highly Bedini cap pulser conditioned, you should be able to cap pulse charge 4 more highly conditioned battery's to full charge, with out any problems.......

[BobZilla]

Ok Mikey I guess I took your post the wrong way. That is the trouble sometimes with forum posting as a communication, it's not the same as a real conversation so you cannot sense a persons tone and whatnot. More like writing a message and tossing it over a wall ;-)

Anyway how about if you start up a thread that is just about some runs you do on the machine so we stop cluttering up this thread. I would be interested in hearing exactly what you have going on with your setup such as the primary battery size, start/end voltage and same on charge, time took at what draw rate, the usual relevant info.

As I said I got my big SS out and will be posting some stuff soon, still trying to get the cap timing set up where I like it. I am using that new micro controlled dumper I had on the rotor machine and have never put it on the SS. I need to figure out the best tuning for it.

[John_Bedini]

I'm getting allot of questions about the TESLA III Charger. So I will attempt to answer some of them here. For one thing the 12 volt Tracker III uses a liner regulation amplifier so some people are asking if they can use a DC supply on the input. The answer is yes as long as you use the current rating of the unit. For example the 12 volt Tracker looks at the panels open circuit voltage and then applies the proper current to the DC amplifier. So the panel voltage is say 0 to 22 volts and the amplifier will start charging at 18 volts which would be normal condition and maximum voltage would be under load around 20 as the battery approaches 15 volts at which point the liner regulators will not push any more current to the battery for safety reasons.So even if the solar panel voltage goes up to 22.5 volts the battery will just be floating at 15 with no real current. The Red Light stays on... Yes this is a small amount of battery current to keep the circuits stable it only amounts to about 20Ma so don't worry about it. Does the unit have blocking diodes?. YES three 50 amp bridges. Why is the fan so fast. Easy question. The Liner Amplifiers must be kept around 70 to 90 C and the Emitter resistors must be kept with air flow around them as all the current flows through them to balance the transistors. The resistors are .1 ohms and the devices are selected for current and high voltage since the devices are running at 16 amps each It is Wakefield forced air cooled sink. If you stop the fan or slow it down it may cause the charger to go into thermal runaway. That fan must not be blocked in any way, and yes it has the correct air flow as we measure it so in a way it is a pressurized case. Is the unit Transistors? Yes and they are P devices for speed each one is bata matched. Why did you not use fets? because you cant get a good one anymore.

Now, IF you want to learn liner amplifier circuits then come to the next conference since I will be using this type of system with the Bike wheel SSG machine. And you will probably see what else can be done with Liner Regulator Amplifiers.
John

[John_Bedini]

BroMikey,
That is good progress out of the oscillator I guess you have made real good progress with the batteries and oscillators. Happy to here your doing it.
John B