Gary's "Complete Advanced" SSG Build

[Gary Hammond]

Hi Rodolphe,

That's an interesting test. I am not aware of anyone else experimenting with this

Do you know why the amperage draw decreases slightly? Although you mentioned it, I’d expect if the input voltage is kept at the same or slightly higher, the amperage draw would be the same or slightly higher too…

I don't remember now how I determined that, it's been too long ago. (Keep in mind that trying to measure "average" current of a pulsed DC circuit with an analog ammeter is only an approximation at best.) But I think that when the transistor shuts off the battery stops supplying current to the main coil and the auxiliary coil discharges into the capacitors increasing their voltage. The next time the transistor turns on it draws current first from the capacitors (a resonate circuit effect) before drawing from the battery. The caps may also supply some charging current to the battery between pulses. The current between the caps and the coils can change much more rapidly than the current changes and reversals in the battery. The apparent result is a longer run time for the input battery.

Looking at your test data, I suspect that when you reduced the gap between the coils to 8MM the auxiliary coil was beginning to rob some of the energy from the main coil which reduced the charging rate of the output battery. At 12MM you were still only picking up "stray" or otherwise "lost" flux as reflected in your recorded charge battery rates.

Gary Hammond,

[pearldragon]

Hi Gary,

Back PoP circuit with spare main coil underneath main coil
I build the backpop circuit as per the attachment, so only with the my spare main coil under the main coil. I left the generator coil out for now, since I want to know the impact of both extra coils individually before combining them.

With these tests I just wanted to get a rough idea how the voltage in the capacitors would by impacted (when not connected to the input battery) if rotor speed changes and if the gap would be reduced (between the coils). See attachment for a short report.

Do you know why the amperage draw decreases slightly? Although you mentioned it, I’d expect if the input voltage is kept at the same or slightly higher, the amperage draw would be the same or slightly higher too…

Best regards.
Rodolphe
148 - 2022-04-23 - Attachment.pdf

[Gary Hammond]

Hi Rodolphe,

Hi Gary,

Any particular reason why you didn't try to build it? At the end of EFV Part 37, JB seems to hint that with this Linear Amplifier you can use just 1 battery (instead of a separate input/output battery).

Regards,
Rodolphe

Figured if I really wanted one, I would just buy it from Teslagenx. Plus I was ready to move on to some other projects, some of which I still haven't fully explored.

Gary Hammond,

[pearldragon]

Hi Gary,

Any particular reason why you didn't try to build it? At the end of EFV Part 37, JB seems to hint that with this Linear Amplifier you can use just 1 battery (instead of a separate input/output battery).

Regards,
Rodolphe

[Gary Hammond]

Hi Rodolphe,

Have you tried switching the connections of your coils to your voltage double arrangement? In case the wave forms would be symmetric than this should have no influence, but I guess they are not symmetric and hence I expect there will be a difference in voltage depending how you connect them. I’ll try this anyway myself once I start testing again, just curious if you tried this as well.

The waveform from the generator coil is symmetrical, but the waveform of the upside down coil is asymmetrical which causes one capacitor of the doubling circuit to charge to a higher voltage than the other one. But because the power is taken from across both capacitors in series, the total voltage across the two in series remains the same regardless of coil polarity in my original setup using a total of four capacitors - i.e.- two for each coil.

I think your schematic should work ok even though the two wave forms are very different from each other. They are paralleled after rectification so shouldn't interfere with each other, but rather be additive.

I'm not so sure about this answer now, as the voltages coming from the upside down coil are asymmetrical. With only two caps used, the coils will have a common reference voltage between the caps rather than a floating voltage across the caps. This may cause an imbalance in charging and a reduced overall effect.

Linear amplifier
I read through the thread regarding the linear amplifier (also sold by TGX), have you built one yourself (according to any of the posted schematics)?

No. I haven't tried building one myself.

Gary Hammond,

[pearldragon]

Hi Gary,

Sorry for the slow reply. Got a bit sick but better now.

Ok good to know what you’re caps were, that gives me a ball park figure.

Have you tried switching the connections of your coils to your voltage double arrangement? In case the wave forms would be symmetric than this should have no influence, but I guess they are not symmetric and hence I expect there will be a difference in voltage depending how you connect them. I’ll try this anyway myself once I start testing again, just curious if you tried this as well.

Linear amplifier
I read through the thread regarding the linear amplifier (also sold by TGX), have you built one yourself (according to any of the posted schematics)?

Regards
Rodolphe

[Gary Hammond]

Hi Rodolphe,

Is there a specific reason/advantage why one should build the circuit as in the attachment of my post #138 (= both coils use their own set of capacitors), instead of in the attachment of this post (= both coils use the same set of capacitors)?

The reason is because I originally had separate loads (42 LEDs each) for each coil. The upside down coil was an added experiment after the generator coil and it's load were already installed. Then I later tried joining the two circuits in parallel to power a single load or charge a single battery.This was an experiment to see what would happen. It worked. The voltages equalized when hooked in parallel to a single load. It was a process of progression from one goal to another goal.

I think your schematic should work ok even though the two wave forms are very different from each other. They are paralleled after rectification so shouldn't interfere with each other, but rather be additive.

Secondly, do you remember what size (roughly) the capacitors were (in uF) that you used for each coil?

I think they were 15,000 uF each, because that's what I had on hand at the time. They are probably larger than needed.

Gary Hammond,

[pearldragon]

Hi Gary,

Is there a specific reason/advantage why one should build the circuit as in the attachment of my post #138 (= both coils use their own set of capacitors), instead of in the attachment of this post (= both coils use the same set of capacitors)?

Secondly, do you remember what size (roughly) the capacitors were (in uF) that you used for each coil?

Best regards,
Rodolphe
142 - 2022-02-28 - Attachment.pdf

[Gary Hammond]

Hi Rodolphe,

Just to double check if I understand you correctly here; that small battery was used only to power the Arduino.

Yes. That is correct.

Gary Hammond,

[pearldragon]

Hi Gary,

Thanks for your quick reply.

LiFePo batteries

John discussed this in "Energy From The Vacuum Part 37

I have the DVD, just quickly skipped to the end since I remember that there he mentioned something about it. He starts talking about is at about 02:09:40. But what he basically says is that more experimentation needs to be done with these type of batteries and that they cannot handle the spikes from the SG, but that they do work well with the added linear amplifier circuit. What I wander is if they also would not be able to deal with common ground/generator mode, but I guess not since it still contains some spike/radiant.

Spare coil/generator coil

The best effect was when I used this method to keep a small battery charged that was powering the Arduino micro-controller on my 4 battery swapper, which in turn was powering my SSG.

Just to double check if I understand you correctly here; that small battery was used only to power the Arduino.

Best regards,
Rodolphe

[Gary Hammond]

Hi Rodolphe,

It’s been a while, how are things?

Things are going great. We're at our new winter vacation home in sunny Florida, on the Gulf coast, 1200 miles from the winter weather back home.

Do you have any references to this: DVD/Book/forum? Know anybody who experimented with this?

John discussed this in "Energy From The Vacuum Part 37" which is available here. http://teslagenx.com/dvds/eftv_37.html?category=dvds

-I guess I would need to monitor the voltage level of the battery that I’m charging to not over charge it. But this is no difference than I need to do with my SG as it is; also there I need to stop the SG of course if the battery is charged.

That's correct. The output is very low current wise, so over charging and/or monitoring would not be a problem.

Do I understand your setup correctly as indicated in Attachment 1?

Yes. You have it shown the way I did it.

Secondly, when you’re saying ‘Reduce the input current draw’. Do you mean:
-That you physically see the input current meter go down in value? E.g. from 1.6amp to 1.4amps?
-Or do you mean that not as much Ah from the battery are drawn compared to when not used this setup, in other words, when charging the input battery, the re-charge time is reduced.

Both answers are correct, but it was only a very small effect when applied to the primary run battery of the SSG. ...........The best effect was when I used this method to keep a small battery charged that was powering the Arduino micro-controller on my 4 battery swapper, which in turn was powering my SSG.

Gary Hammond,

[pearldragon]

Hi Gary,

It’s been a while, how are things?

I’m still waiting for my new TGX charger(s) so haven’t done more testing since our last contact. But I have to admit that I also lost spirit a bit for the following reasons:
The realization that the bottle neck of my performance was not in the machine, but in the batteries. And that with 3 different types of batteries I used, using them in all kinds of setups (parallel, single), I was not able to get close to 1 COP, made the realization sink in that there is no guarantee that buying 3 new types of batteries will yield any better result, it might, it might not, it would be a lucky shot. What kept me wandering though is how it can be possible that your batteries seemed to be the right batteries to use; Both your AGMs and your Lawn & Garden batteries.
Another thing that didn’t aid in motivating myself is the realization that the batteries we’re using are all battery types that in the near future will all be replaced by newer type batteries, like Li-Ion or LiFePo, so would it be worth it burning so many hours finding the ‘right’ old-type-batteries…
Then I asked myself what the alternatives were: stopping this project, or starting another project, and both of those options are even less attractive, so like AC/DC said, ‘back in the ring to take another swing’. As mentioned, although still waiting for the TSX chargers, I can do some more preparation/learning/discussing here by sharing ideas and questions with you. And on the positive side; those LiFePo might be a battery type a bit more future-proof.

Back to where we left off:

LiFePo batteries From your post #134:

He did, however, experiment with LiFePo batteries and developed a special circuit to charge them with either an SSG or a plugin charger. These batteries are superior to Li-ions, but are very expensive to buy.

Do you have any references to this: DVD/Book/forum? Know anybody who experimented with this?
A couple of months I got in contact with a fellow Dutch guy who was one of the speakers on the ESTC 2021. He also told me that he was told on that conference that some very good results were achieved with LiFePo batteries. I just wrote him a message again last week to see if I can meetup with him.

Spare coil/generator coil: Direct load connected to doubling voltage arrangement From your post #136:

2- Advantage is a higher voltage output for a direct load. Not sure about when charging another capacitor, as in the comparator.

If I would use this output to connect it directly to charge another (separate) battery, would that not be a bit tricky/dangerous for the following reasons:
-Would I need to manage the charging voltage very accurately? (what voltage range would I be aiming for a 12V battery? 14-16V?) Or is this done automatically; as soon as the capacitors charge up to a voltage to overcome the resistance threshold to charge the battery they will and will temporarily stop charging the moment the voltage falls below this threshold, etc?
-I guess I would need to monitor the voltage level of the battery that I’m charging to not over charge it. But this is no difference than I need to do with my SG as it is; also there I need to stop the SG of course if the battery is charged.

Spare coil/generator coil: Setup & Reduce the input current draw From your post #136:

P.S. - Keep in mind that my upside down coil circuit was used to drive 42 LEDs. I also used a separate generator coil (with an identical voltage doubling cap/diode arrangement) to drive another 42 LEDs. I don't have a small enough comparator to use on either of these circuits. BUT, I was able to parallel the outputs of these (without the LEDs) to either charge another battery and/or connect them back to the input battery to reduce the input current draw.

Do I understand your setup correctly as indicated in Attachment 1?
Secondly, when you’re saying ‘Reduce the input current draw’. Do you mean:
-That you physically see the input current meter go down in value? E.g. from 1.6amp to 1.4amps?
-Or do you mean that not as much Ah from the battery are drawn compared to when not used this setup, in other words, when charging the input battery, the re-charge time is reduced.
The latter I’d understand, the former not (yet ).

Best regards,
Rodolphe
138 - 2022-02-22 - Attachment 1.pdf

[pearldragon]

Hi Gary,

Just a quick reply/note to let you know that my SG experiments are on hold for a while since I had issues with my TGX charger. Waiting for new ones to come in to continue testing. Meanwhile I might post some more here to discuss some questions ideas about for the (near) future as we’ve been doing here already in the last couple of posts.
Last thing that I did for my SG was designing a quick frame on which my whole SG can be mounted/rest, while the frame itself has a cavity which I can adjust in height an put my spare coil in, see image. I got the frame made and it fits nice.
But at the moment my I’ve started some basic (separate) high voltage experiments, just to learn a bit about them, while waiting for the new chargers to come in. So my attention has shifted a bit to those for now.

Best regards,
Rodolphe

[Gary Hammond]

Hi Rodolphe,

1-)Did I indicate the FWB and the doubling voltage arrangement (DVA) correctly in attachment 1?
2-)If correct, what advantage would the DVA have over the FWB version? Higher voltage output?
(The downside of the DVA would be that I need to find the right size for the caps for the DVA and the comparator, while with the FWB version I only need to size the cap or the comparator).
3-)Why would you not connect the output of the comparator directly to the output battery of the SG, see attachment 2? Would the two systems (CG mode & comparator) interfere with each other, sending CG output into the comparator and visa versa?

1- Yes, the schematic is correct for both.
2- Advantage is a higher voltage output for a direct load. Not sure about when charging another capacitor, as in the comparator. ............ ZPDM experimented with capacitors a lot. Some of which is shown in these two threads. https://www.energyscienceforum.com/f...acitor-paradox ........................ https://www.energyscienceforum.com/forum/alternative-energy/john-bedini/2653-solid-state-battery-charger
3- You correctly answered your own question.

What you’re saying is: if the gap is too close, you couple the coils, and the drag/load will be noticeable in the SG output performance, whilst when sufficient space is between the coil, you only capture stray flux, and the effect is not noticeable on the SG output. And because you/I only capture the stray flux, I do need to put the windings in series to get an high enough output of the 2^nd coil. Correctly summarized like that?

Yes. That was my thinking. ...................................Whether correct thinking or not, I did get the results I was looking for.

No, this is where he connects one end of the little light to a frame (not connected to the battery terminals) and the other end of the light he touches on of the plastic caps of the battery and the light goes on, see attachment 3. The batteries are charged with a solid state charger (so it seems).

That is where he used a neon lamp to check for the presence of high voltage "radiant energy". In those photos you can also see the protection neons across the 6 transistors are also on, indicating the circuit was putting very high voltage spikes into the battery. I never intentionally operate my SSG at this high of a voltage level. It also appears that he was charging large 6 volt batteries. Don't know if it was only one battery or several in series and/or parallel? Again, I don't have this particular DVD.

Gary Hammond,

P.S. - Keep in mind that my upside down coil circuit was used to drive 42 LEDs. I also used a separate generator coil (with an identical voltage doubling cap/diode arrangement) to drive another 42 LEDs. I don't have a small enough comparator to use on either of these circuits. BUT, I was able to parallel the outputs of these (without the LEDs) to either charge another battery and/or connect them back to the input battery to reduce the input current draw.

[pearldragon]

Hi Gary,

2^nd Coil under main coil

If you were to use a spare power coil, you would need to connect all the windings (including the trigger winding) in series in order to get a high enough voltage to be useful. I wouldn't connect it to the SSG output at all. But like you show, it could drive a separate, small comparator to charge another small battery. Or you could also use it to back pop the run battery for reduced run current draw.
The circuit you have shown is a half wave rectifier. I would either use a full wave rectifier or else a voltage doubling diode/cap arrangement like I used.

1-)Did I indicate the FWB and the doubling voltage arrangement (DVA) correctly in attachment 1?
2-)If correct, what advantage would the DVA have over the FWB version? Higher voltage output?
(The downside of the DVA would be that I need to find the right size for the caps for the DVA and the comparator, while with the FWB version I only need to size the cap or the comparator).
3-)Why would you not connect the output of the comparator directly to the output battery of the SG, see attachment 2? Would the two systems (CG mode & comparator) interfere with each other, sending CG output into the comparator and visa versa?

I didn't want to couple directly and place an added load on the main coil. I was only seeing if I could capture some of the stray, lost flux that would otherwise be unrecoverable. I got the results I was looking for, so didn't experiment any with the gap. I'm only guessing at the gap. May be as small as 1/4" or somewhere between 1/4" and 1/2". The cores of the coil spools extended maybe 1/8" to 1/4" past the spools through a common hole in a 3/4" board with the spools directly across from each other. It was easy to mount the spools directly to the board, so that's what I did.

What you’re saying is: if the gap is too close, you couple the coils, and the drag/load will be noticeable in the SG output performance, whilst when sufficient space is between the coil, you only capture stray flux, and the effect is not noticeable on the SG output. And because you/I only capture the stray flux, I do need to put the windings in series to get an high enough output of the 2^nd coil. Correctly summarized like that?

Connections

Don't remember the results exactly, but think I got maybe 10% faster wheel speed, 10 to 30% higher voltage spikes on the o-scope, and maybe a 10 to 20% reduction in charging time. Been a while since I did this, so am a little fuzzy about the differences I observed. I just know that it was well worth the small effort required to reduce the impedance losses.

I understand what you say. Since I didn’t notice any difference with the different connection options or wire length so far with my 10AWG wire, I’m not sure if I can get much better results with my 10 AWG wire. However, going to 8 AWG might make a difference.

Lithium / Li-ion

I haven't experimented with Li-ion batteries at all. John Bedini did and reported that they don't like being charged by the SSG at all. They require a highly monitored hot charger and will not tolerate much over voltage. The temperature and upper charging voltage are critical. If exceeded, the battery may be permanently damaged or catch fire.
He did, however, experiment with LiFePo batteries and developed a special circuit to charge them with either an SSG or a plugin charger. These batteries are superior to Li-ions, but are very expensive to buy.

I asked Erik from TGX the same question a while ago and he said that hi had very little experience with it, that the Li-Ion batteries didn’t seem to like the pulse/cap dump charging.
Via via I heard from somebody else too that the LiFePo batteries seemed to be able to handle to charge with an SG, don’t have details yet.

Light bulb test

No. I don't have that DVD and have not done that experiment. Is that where the bulb is placed in the trigger lead, or where he checks the output of the machine?

No, this is where he connects one end of the little light to a frame (not connected to the battery terminals) and the other end of the light he touches on of the plastic caps of the battery and the light goes on, see attachment 3. The batteries are charged with a solid state charger (so it seems).

Best regards,
Rodolphe
135 - 2021-09-28 - Attachments.pdf