Gary's "Complete Advanced" SSG Build

[Gary Hammond]

Hi Rodolphe,

I had a feeling maybe you are an engineer, with all your attention to detail and exactness. LOL Just curious, what is your engineering specialty?

Here's a link to the welding rod I use on all my projects. It's the R60 grade JB recommended in all his videos. https://www.mscdirect.com/product/details/59802314?rItem=59802314
The R value of the rod specifies the tensile strength, which is a result of it's alloying content and is pretty standardized in the U.S. I cut them to maybe 3mm longer than the spool and then paint them with acrylic black paint to help increase resistance between them and reduce eddy currents. After they dry I pack them into the spool as tightly as possible, driving in the last 2 or 3 with a hammer. Next I put supper glue on the ends of the rods until it soaks all the way through to the bottom end. And lastly, I grind the rod ends flush with the ends of the spool to get the copper wire turns as close as possible to the end of the core.

As for the base resistors, if you have resistors at 100.1 ohms and 99.9 ohms that's .2 ohms difference or expressed as percentage .2% difference. If you have 470 ohm resistors with one at 470.1 and one at 469.9 with .2 ohms difference that's only .2/470 or .04255%. It's much easier to get a good match with higher resistance values. And for some reason, using fixed resistors in each branch that are near the total required value, with only a low value pot, seems to produce a more stable circuit than one that uses a larger value pot. The main base resistance remains more closely matched with only a small value tuning pot. Plus pots are less stable than fixed resistors and will sometimes drift when in use.

As for the MJL21194 transistors available, they are not all created equal in quality. Some of the cheap Chinese ones on E-bay are very low quality and have a high failure rate. Even when closely matched, they can still cause problems with performance and reliability. Be sure to use only ones from a reputable manufacturer and trusted supplier. Since I didn't want to buy a hundred or more transistors to get a good match, I just ordered them from Teslagenx in the kit along with the matched resistors.

Gary Hammond,

P.S. There's one other little thing I forgot to mention before. When I first ran the test that I reported on my home page, I had the charge battery negative connected directly to the negative of the primary batteries without going through the isolation diode. This gave the best results. I added the isolation diode at a later date which dropped the COP from 1.25 to about 1.13 as best I remember. When the batteries are less than .6 volts apart, which is the forward voltage drop of the output diodes, they don't self equalize when the negatives are connected together.

Adding the isolation diode raises this to 1.2 volts required to self equalize, which allows for a greater voltage difference between the primary and secondary. It also introduces more total resistance and a longer charge time.

[RS_]

"When you say ‘to help out I assume you mean in the way of generating energy? Not in the way of causing drag/bringing the RPMs down?"

I mean both. The drag lowers the current draw of a SG/SSG helping to up the COP. A genny coil/coils up's total COP by utilizing the 33% mechanical output of a SG/SSG that is wasted otherwise.
I have lit Led arrays from genny coils, but using genny coils to feed a cap pulser and charge a 2nd primary input battery is the best use of genny coils out put. I have also used genny coils to cap pulse back pop the primary drive battery momentarily, while the SG/SSG continues to run from a BIG Cap during the back pop. There is a circuit I posted for this here on the forum some where.

"I think we misunderstood each other here. I actually meant a radiant battery charger, like this one: http://www.teslagenx.com/chargers/tx...egory=chargers."

SG = Cap pulser charger
SSG = the direct diode to battery charger
I have used chargers like the one you link to, to charge primary battery's, and that is a good place for you to start.
Once a battery is conditioned for several cycles with the Bedini cap pulser, they will run a SG/SSG far longer than a standard charger battery will, as they keep losing capacity each time you discharge them and recharge them (sulphnation)sp, where a Bedini charged battery gets better and better, each charge / discharge cycle. (desulphnation)sp

"I was hoping you’d have a SG performing above COP 1, with a PCB board with 100 Ohm resistors like mine"

No, I do not have any TeslagenX SSG PCB's stuffed up, although I do have 1. My designed SSG PCB's are 16 transistors each. With 3 of these for my 6 coil 48 strand/transistor SSG that charged L16 Battery's at 24V, that I described the branched trigger resistor layout in my last post.

Do you use a auto Lamp in your trigger circuits? That really helps to keep a SG/SSG in tune while a primary battery runs down.... This is a trick that JB ask me to try for him and report back to him on the results, over 6 mo's before he told the rest of the forums about it.

"Anyhow, with the core material being the new candidate"

I use the Lincoln Electric Brand copper coated R60 rods. I cut them to length and soak them in water overnight so they rust and develop a green patina that reduces Eddie currents in the core, keeping them from getting hot.

"Did you start rebuilding afterwards?"

It took 8 mo's to go through it all, and do the innovatory for the insurance company. I rebuilt the shop. Then 2 years ago we were forced to move because TxDot want to build a new highway loop across the front 1/2 of our property taking out the house, garage and my greenhouse/aquaponics system. Now I have a new shop over at our new location, because the old shop on the back 1/2 is too far away to go there to work. Now that it has cooled down from the summer heat, I will show pics and video of the new shop soon, when I start putting the Ferris Wheel together inside it.

[pearldragon]

Hi Gary, RS,

Thanks Gary, I’m a Mechanical Engineer, a contractor. Not so much calculations (I do some), more design, prototyping. I work a lot with the CAD program Solidworks.

Welding Rods / Core
I updated my post #89: The link and Rods I stated there are incorrect; I used R45 rods, link is updated too.
Thanks for your link. Do you know if those rods are the same as TeslaGenX uses (still awaiting their answer)? / Did you only ordered the pre-wound coil and ordered the rods yourself?

Although TeslaGenX uses R60 too, as mentioned, they do not necessarily have to be the exact same composition.
In case you do have the exact same rods as TeslaGenX, I just might buy those to eliminate doubt for the dutch equivalent, see next paragraph. Assuming that the weldingrod do not come with a clear (isolation) coating, spray painting the rods is a good idea… I assume that would make a difference too. And lastly, I grind the rod ends flush with the ends of the spool to get the copper wire turns as close as possible to the end of the core. A bit in doubt whether I understand you or not; you mean grinding the tops of the rods flush with the spool (where the magnets pass by). In case you have picture to indicate what you mean this would eliminate doubt.

The rods from your website are Blue Demon RG60-063-01T probably with these specs: https://weldingmaterialsales.com/catalog/r60/ (blue demon website), spec sheet in attachment. I tried to find the same here and found these:
https://certilas.com/en/product/g3, spec sheet in the attachment. Both AWS A5.2 R60. However, as you can see the compositions still differ and the percentage of some of the materials too. The only thing I’m interested in is that the electrical/magnetic specs match… and for that the iron content is the most important I guess, which will be the majority of the composition (but that would be true too for theR45 material I have now).

Resistors
I understand your reasoning, but if I order resistors here, they are specified with a deviation percentage, regardless of the value. Highest accuracy I can get is 470-Ohm +/-0.25%, 0.4W +/-25%, In 0.6W or 1W versions, they come with a +/-0.5% deviation.

Transistors
Mine come from ON Semiconductors, from the United States of Trump, sorry America . https://nl.rs-online.com/web/p/bjt-b...stors/7743571/ But if I place my new order at TeslaGenX, I’ll order 8 matched ones from them.

Diodes
Just to make sure we’re on the same page, is your naming of the diodes in accordance with how I indicated them in the attachment?
To match the performance from the setup on your home page is the next step, but my first step is to match your post #29. Can you tell me if during that test you had the isolation diode(s)* installed or not?
*I installed 2 in parallel as you recommended.

When the batteries are less than .6 volts apart, which is the forward voltage drop of the output diodes, they don't self-equalize when the negatives are connected together.

Could you please explain a bit more about the advantage/disadvantage of this isolation diode and/or self equalizing at 0.6V or 1.2V?

Best regards,
Rodolphe
2020-09-25 - Attachment.pdf
Welding rods - Core material - Certilas - mat. nr. 1.6215 - A5.2 R65 - 8554.G3 -Certificate.pdf
Welding rods - Core material - Blue Demon - AWS A5.2 spec.pdf

[Gary Hammond]

Hi Rodolphe,

I’m a Mechanical Engineer, a contractor. Not so much calculations (I do some), more design, prototyping. I work a lot with the CAD program Solidworks.

I checked out your web page. Looks like you're also a "Gear Head" like me. LOL

Did you only ordered the pre-wound coil and ordered the rods yourself?

Yes, That is correct.

A bit in doubt whether I understand you or not; you mean grinding the tops of the rods flush with the spool (where the magnets pass by)

Yes. That is correct as well.

The only thing I’m interested in is that the electrical/magnetic specs match… and for that the iron content is the most important I guess, which will be the majority of the composition (but that would be true too for theR45 material I have now).

The R45 and R60 are both meant for welding mild, low carbon, steel. I think either one has about the same very low magnetic retention when used as core material for the coil.

Resistors
I understand your reasoning, but if I order resistors here, they are specified with a deviation percentage, regardless of the value. Highest accuracy I can get is 470-Ohm +/-0.25%, 0.4W +/-25%, In 0.6W or 1W versions, they come with a +/-0.5% deviation.

I think Teslagenx also buys large quantities of resistors and then matches them closely for a set in their kits.

Diodes
Just to make sure we’re on the same page, is your naming of the diodes in accordance with how I indicated them in the attachment?

Yes. That is correct.

To match the performance from the setup on your home page is the next step, but my first step is to match your post #29. Can you tell me if during that test you had the isolation diode(s)* installed or not?

Yes. The isolation diode(s) were installed in the test of post #29 just like in your attached drawing.

Could you please explain a bit more about the advantage/disadvantage of this isolation diode and/or self equalizing at 0.6V or 1.2V?

Look at your attachment. In generator mode when the transistor is turned off, the supply (run) battery is basically in parallel with the charge battery with the coil winding and charge diode in the circuit path between them. When any two (or more) batteries are in parallel, they always equalize to the same voltage. So if the run battery is at 13.1 volts and the charge battery is at 12.5 volts they will both come to a voltage somewhere in between. This might be 12.8 volts for example, and happens very quickly when there is no resistance in the circuit path between them. The coil is very low resistance so equalization would happen very fast, except that the diodes each have about a .6 volt forward voltage threshold that must be overcome before any current can flow to allow for equalization. When there are two diodes in the circuit then 1.2 volts need to exist between the batteries before any current can flow to equalize them.

So without the isolation diode self equalization will occur any time the battery voltage difference is between .6 volts and 1.2 volts. That means if the supply (run) battery is at 13.1 volts the charge battery must be 12.5 volts or more to eliminate self equalization and allow for the charge battery voltage to increase only due to coil collapse. With the isolation diode installed, the charge battery could be as low as 11.9 volts without self equalization occurring.

In the test on my home page the run battery was at 13.08 volts and the charge battery was at 12.58 volts for only a .5 volt difference. So I didn't need the isolation diode, which would have added resistance, and slowed down the charging rate.

[pearldragon]

Hi Gary, RS,

I mean both. The drag lowers the current draw of a SG/SSG helping to up the COP. A genny coil/coils up's total COP by utilizing the 33% mechanical output of a SG/SSG that is wasted otherwise.
I have lit Led arrays from genny coils, but using genny coils to feed a cap pulser and charge a 2nd primary input battery is the best use of genny coils out put. I have also used genny coils to cap pulse back pop the primary drive battery momentarily, while the SG/SSG continues to run from a BIG Cap during the back pop. There is a circuit I posted for this here on the forum some where.

I read some terms here that I’ve seen here on the forum and some of Gary’s threads as well. But for now have not put active effort into it to fully understand it, experiment with it, for the simple reason that I think they are add-ons to the basic system. What I mean is that I first need to find out how to get into the ballpark of Gary’s results of post #29 with just the basic setup, and once I achieve that continue to improve output from there with add-on/modifications like you mention in your post. E.g. While reading through the Advanced Handbook, I ordered a genny coil from a local coil-winder here, but it has been sitting laying on the shelf since it came in because I’m still so far out from Gary’s performance.

SG = Cap pulser charger / SSG = the direct diode to battery charger

ok, thanks for explaining that, since the terminology used here on the forum is sometimes a bit confusing, I try to stick with what is described in the manual, just not sure what term you use then for the Radiant stage as it is used in the beginner’s handbook (Radiant mode):
1) ?? = Radiant charging (Beginner’s Handbook)
2) SG = Cap pulser charger (Intermediate Handbook)
3) SSG = the direct diode to battery charger = Common Ground mode (CG) / Generator mode (Advanced Handbook)
With regards to the technology used in the TeslaGenX charger of our previous posts, I guess then that the technology/charging method used in that is a 2) Cap Pulser charger?

No, I do not have any TeslagenX SSG PCB's stuffed up, although I do have 1. My designed SSG PCB's are 16 transistors each. With 3 of these for my 6 coil 48 strand/transistor SSG that charged L16 Battery's at 24V, that I described the branched trigger resistor layout in my last post.

I come back with questions about this once I’ve got my basic setup performing in the ballpark of Gary’s post #29.

Do you use a auto Lamp in your trigger circuits? That really helps to keep a SG/SSG in tune while a primary battery runs down.... This is a trick that JB ask me to try for him and report back to him on the results, over 6 mo's before he told the rest of the forums about it.

I’ve built by the handbooks, apart from the neons to protect the transistors I do not have any auto-lamps in my (trigger)-circuit. Can you explain a bit more about this?
-where exactly is it placed
-what kind of lamp exactly
-how does is help to keep the Sg in tune and what do you mean in this context by keeping it in tune?

I will show pics and video of the new shop soon, when I start putting the Ferris Wheel together inside it.

Ferris Wheel… bringing out the big guns . Looking forward to see some pics.

Best regards,
Rodolphe

[RS_]

First, I do not have the Beginner’s Handbook or Intermediate Handbook or Advanced Handbook... Seeing as to I wrote the very first SG/SSG builders guide with some editing help in about 2008 or so...

1) Radiant charging = SSG = diode direct to the battery: Puts a Negative charge on the battery so that when you try to charge them with a regular charger it takes a LONG Time to eat up the Negative charge, and start charging like normal. Not good as a Primary Run battery. (see Beardens book Energy From the Vacuum on this issue)
2) SG = Cap pulser charger. Is a Positive Charge. Is good for a Primary Run battery

Common Ground mode (CG) / Generator mode (Advanced Handbook) not sure on the terms used in this issue, maybe Gary can help here......

"With regards to the technology used in the TeslaGenX charger of our previous posts, I guess then that the technology/charging method used in that is a 2) Cap Pulser charger?"
This is correct....

The auto tail light lamp goes into the trigger circuit right before the POT and acts like a negative resistor... So as the primary battery runs down, and the rpm's decrease it holds the trigger current steady so that the SG/SSG stays in tune. Because the resistance of the filament in the bulb changes resistance as the trigger current changes as the RPM changes. I have found that for most small setups a model 1895 tail light bulb works good. Bigger muilty coil setups need a higher amp bulb.... at first I went to the local auto parts store and bought 1 each of a whole range of amperage tail light lamp/bulbs and traded them out in my setups till i found the right bulb for that build that glowed through the entire range of rpm's and kept the SG/SSG in tune and not drop into double pulsing at the lower run down drive battery voltages.

Check out the lamp in the trigger circuit below.....

[pearldragon]

Hi Gary, RS,

Sorry for belated response. I’ve started a new contract job, so will not be as quick with responses/questions as I am when I’m free.

Thanks for your clarifications/explanations regarding the diodes and there effects regarding equalizing. To double check:

So without the isolation diode self-equalization will occur any time the battery voltage difference is between .6 volts and 1.2 volts.

I guess this should read:
So without the isolation diode self-equalization will occur any time when the input battery is 0.6 volts or more above the voltage of the output battery.
Correct?

With the isolation diode installed, the charge battery could be as low as 11.9 volts without self equalization occurring.

In the test on my home page the run battery was at 13.08 volts and the charge battery was at 12.58 volts for only a .5 volt difference. So I didn't need the isolation diode, which would have added resistance, and slowed down the charging rate.

So to summarize, the isolation diode is only a safety measure and actually only required when the output battery would be more than 0.6V lower than the input battery.

For now I’ll keep them in since you had them installed in your test of post #29. If I (finally) are up to that performance level, than I’ll continue with trying to make more modifications/match the results from your website.

I’ve been e-mailing a bit with TeslaGenX, today have placed an order for:
-8 matched transistors
-new pre-wound coil + R60 rods
- TX-2A12 charger (same you have Gary)
-some dvds

They’ve told me that the charger as it standard is might be a bit too much for the small AGMs I have, but might be able to built in a switch to toggle between AGM/Flooded Lead Acid.

Best regards,
Rodolphe

[Gary Hammond]

Hi Rodolphe,

So without the isolation diode self-equalization will occur any time when the input battery is 0.6 volts or more above the voltage of the output battery.
Correct?

Yes. That is correct.

Gary Hammond,

[pearldragon]

Hi Gary, RS,
RS, I response to your post #96:

Thanks for the image and explanation.

It is good that we talked about the thermology of indicating the different modes of operation; I know now which mode you refer to with which term.

The auto tail light lamp goes into the trigger circuit right before the POT and acts like a negative resistor... So as the primary battery runs down, and the rpm's decrease it holds the trigger current steady so that the SG/SSG stays in tune. Because the resistance of the filament in the bulb changes resistance as the trigger current changes as the RPM changes.

I experienced that during the charging process the RPMs increase, rather than decrease. But I guess the same applies there: if the RPMs increase, the resistance of the bulb increases too.

So do I understand correctly from the image/your post that this extra light bulb mod, is done mainly for SSG en SG mode? To prevent the machine front falling back from single pulses to multi-pulsing/firing somewhere down the charging process? But does this really happen? I mean; I’ve looked at the pulses during tuning at the beginning of a charge, cycle, and was not so much paying attention to the end of the cycle; whether it fell back to a double firing/pulsing (when I would start out with a single pulse). But taking into account that the rpms only went up, I assume it did not fall back from single to double pulsing, or from double pulsing to triple pulsing… Then my question is, will this bring an advantage to my machine while using it in SG/SSG mode, or only add extra resistance?

As you can read in the initial posts from Gary in this thread, Gary obtained best results in SSG mode with double pulsing, rather than single pulsing.

With the tests that I’ve been doing, trying to match Gary, I’ve only worked with in Common Ground (generator) mode, so assume it is of lesser value in that mode anyways, correct? I did experiment with SSG mode before, got some data from it. SG mode I only worked with very briefly. When I got to the CG (generator) mode, I’ve been main concerned with those results.

In the image it reads “tune motor to it’s lowers current/highest rpm sweet spot”. In the parts handbooks, when explaining about the SSG/SG mode it talks about this too, but also there I’ve found this a sentence a bit hard to interpret based on my own attempts of tuning: Either I tune it to the lowest amperage input OR to the highest RPM (SSG/SSG mode), but those two do not coincide with the tests of my machine…

Best regards,
Rodolphe

[RS_]

I had most of a post for you written... Windows just had to update and reboot while i was out doing errands .... The auto save error-ed out and i lost it all..... will try again later

[pearldragon]

Hi RS,

No worries, looking forward to your reply.

Best Regards,
Rodolphe

[pearldragon]

Hi Gary, RS,

While still awaiting my order from TeslaGenX and busy with work, I decided to continue with the theory. So I watched DVD34.4 again. And have the following questions/remarks that I would like to discuss with you:

Radiant mode COP
@14min45sec John says that you should be able to charge 2 batteries at the output, before reaching the 11V / 12V limit at the input battery. Since he doesn’t specify how far the output batteries are depleted, this statement is a bit of a guess how to interpreted, but how I interpreted it is that he says in radiant mode you can get a COP of 2 (while using 2 batteries at the output). Although I haven’t tried charging 2 batteries in parallel yet, this seems an extreme COP for radiant mode to me…

Keeping the input battery charged
11min20sec “force the battery to charge, not depleting the primary” (CG mode)
I doubt if he expresses himself correctly here (or if I interpreted him correctly): If you’re charging a (partly) depleted output battery, my input battery has always gone down in voltage…

What in my opinions gives room for misinterpretation of the above mentioned is the following:
A couple of times (e.g. @+/-43min5sec / 46min28sec) he shows that the input battery goes up in voltage which you can see indeed. However, if you look at te graph @+/-47min3sec, you see that the output battery is way overcharged. If from the graph you calculate back to when it was that the output battery passed the point of 15.3V, you notice that this was somewhere @39min. In other words, this “primary goes up” only applies when the output battery is already fully-/over charged.
Does this primary charging effect has to do with the following: The released energy from the coil needs to go somewhere, and if the output battery is already fully-/over charged, the only other way it can go is to the input battery?

No Drag
@12min17sec he says “this is not gonna drag”
Also here in my interpretation of the matter it would need a nuance by saying: the drag is going to be minimal. As stated in my post #4 on this thread:
https://www.energyscienceforum.com/f...-advanced-book

Isolation Diode (for CG mode)
We’ve been talking about the isolation diode in posts #94/97/98. What you’ve explained there is crystal clear to me. However, in the DVD @44min30sec “Frank” give some more/other explanation about the function of this diode which I find a bit harder to grasp… I do not understand how that isolation diode is going to make a difference with regards to the ions being able to move forward/backwards with the first diode already in place…
While writing this, a new idea of understanding comes into my mind about what Frank means here. So when in the above I say I do not see how this isolation diode is going to make a change since the first diode is already making sure there is only a “one way street” for the current to flow, I didn’t consider that the battery can still experience something like a “push back” (how frank calls it) from the pulse on the terminal side where there would be no diode (in case the isolation diode would not be there). In other words, that the battery would act a bit as a spring.
Now the next question/idea rises: If this theory of Frank would be true – that this “push back” effect in the absence of the isolation battery causes slower charging – this does not show in practice based on what you wrote at the end of your post #91. There you say that the COP dropped from 1.25 to 1.13 when you installed the isolation diode…
See also attachment.

Light Bulb
RS, @1hour12min47sec John mentions that this version does not have the lightbulb anymore, but a fixed resister. Based on what he says there I interpret the lightbulb was used in a previous version.

Looking forward to your comments,
Best regards,
Rodolphe
Attachment 2020-12-02.pdf

[Gary Hammond]

Hi Rodolphe,

Radiant mode COP ............
I've not been able to accomplish this with my machine either, but I've also not specifically tried to do it either. John may have been referring to some of his early experiments where he accomplished this while using a mechanical capacitor discharge connected to the radiant mode output. This has been widely shown on the internet and used a different designed machine that what we use which is what he showed in the video and at the conference. (I was at that conference and witnessed what is in the video.) He may also have been referring to his later 10 coiler and the bank of cell tower batteries that easily exceeded a COP of 2. (Even though I was there, I didn't personally question him about this.)

RS may be able to explain more about this?





See all these and more at http://johnbedini.net/john34/bedinibearden.html

Be sure to scroll to the bottom of the above link when you open it and look at the TUV test.




Keeping the input battery charged ..............
What I observed at the conference, and also with my experiments, is that the input battery voltage only goes up when the input current drops off. That happens near the end of the charge. Any time a battery is under load (delivering current) the measured voltage will also vary inversely with respect to the current draw due to internal resistance in the battery.

No Drag.................
Compared to a regular, conventional, generator there is almost no drag on the wheel. ( If this wheel had only generator coils installed and was driven by a regular DC motor, it couldn't even begin to charge another battery. The drag would be so much that the wheel might not even turn! ) What very little drag that occurs diminishes as the charge battery voltage increases and the run current falls off. You've seen this yourself and even commented on it.The wheel speeds up as the charge battery voltage increases. It does this in all modes of operation, but especially in common ground mode.

Isolation Diode (for CG mode) ..........................
I didn't really understand Frank's explanation either, and was there and heard him say it. What I observed with my machine was a lowering of the COP which I attributed to the increased resistance from using the isolation diode plus the loss of any equalization current between the batteries, as I explained previously.

Gary Hammond,

[pearldragon]

Hi Gary,

Radiant mode COP
I had a look at the website and read through the TUV part. Unfortunately it doesn’t state which machine is used and in which mode, so for myself I cannot bring this into accurate relation with JB’s statement about radiant mode COP2 (apart from the fact that there is more unclear to me “One lead acid gel-cell (12 volts, 450 milliamps)”…. does “gel” mean AGM? 450mA, means 450mAh? Or discharged at 450mAh? There is no need to dive into this, I just wanted point out that there is too few information for me there to make any assessment).
What I did find noteworthy is that he started charge/discharge cycles almost immediately when the one after another, where I leave the batteries resting for at least an hour.
But to come back to JB statement about the radiant mode COP2; one needs to obtain a COP of 1 with one battery at the output, in to get to a COP of 2 with 2 batteries (assuming the input battery doesn’t notice too much of the second parallel output battery). In your post #10 you write about your radiant test, but the COP is not specified.

Multi coiler / 10 coiler
After I’ve been able to get closer to your results which I’ve been trying to peruse so vigorously , I’m considering a multi coiler. At the moment I know close to nothing about this yet, I have a lot of questions about it. But will first watch/read some documentation and videos I have about it; probably will find some answers in there already.

Keeping the input battery charged
So far I have not seen the voltage go up at my input battery, neither at the end of the charging process. But it might have happened when I would overcharged beyond 15.3V. I do have to say that I only have looked at the voltage of the input battery at the beginning and at the end of a cycle, not somewhere in the middle. If you would see the increase of the input battery already before hitting 15.3V at the output battery, that would indicate a difference with your and my cycles we haven’t noticed before, then I might do a load cycle with the voltage monitor on it.

No Drag

If this wheel had only generator coils installed and was driven by a regular DC motor, it couldn't even begin to charge another battery. The drag would be so much that the wheel might not even turn!

Not sure if I understand you correctly here: It are these generator coils from the Advanced Handbook that have little drag, so if you put these around the rotor (to charge the output), and you’d connect a DC motor to the shaft as the input/actual motor to turn the rotor, why would this DC motor experience a lot of drag?
I certainly did notice the increase in speed towards the end of a cycle and that this is a result of a decrease in drag sounds plausible. But when I think about it now, I lack the exact understanding of it, is the following reasoning correct?: talking about my machine (so no generator coils), in Radiant mode; as soon as the magnet passes its point closes to the coil, so starting to move away from the coil, the following two phenomenon cause drag on the rotor:
1-the discharging/releasing of the energy in the coil (Event C, see attachment)
2-induced current in trigger circuit (see attachment)
1-only diminishes I guess only because of the drop of voltage in the input battery over time
2-would only increase since the speed of the rotor increases…
So than my conclusion would be that the phenomena 1- weighs heavier than 2-, with a net effect of reduction in drag an thus increase of rotor speed.

Isolation diode
Well, then the story of Frank/JB might in theory be true, but might in practice be outweighed by the resistance effect of the extra diode.

Batteries degrade in SG mode
Something else I forgot to mention that caught my attention in the video is the following: @50min23sec JB mentions that batteries degrade in SG mode. Then @50min51sec somebody asks him to confirm that, but then JB, doesn’t want to confirm it, and replies that he need to run more cycles (to verify).

Best regards,
Rodolphe
2020-12-05 Attachment.pdf

[Gary Hammond]

Hi Rodolphe,

Radiant Mode COP

Unfortunately it doesn’t state which machine is used and in which mode, so for myself I cannot bring this into accurate relation with JB’s statement about radiant mode COP2 (apart from the fact that there is more unclear to me “One lead acid gel-cell (12 volts, 450 milliamps)”…. does “gel” mean AGM? 450mA, means 450mAh? Or discharged at 450mAh? There is no need to dive into this, I just wanted point out that there is too few information for me there to make any assessment).
What I did find noteworthy is that he started charge/discharge cycles almost immediately when the one after another, where I leave the batteries resting for at least an hour.
But to come back to JB statement about the radiant mode COP2; one needs to obtain a COP of 1 with one battery at the output, in to get to a COP of 2 with 2 batteries (assuming the input battery doesn’t notice too much of the second parallel output battery).

I have the same observations and questions about the TUV test as you have. That's why I asked RS to chime in as well. He had a working relationship with John and has seen all these machines up close.

I think in the TUV test, John used the one shown in my last post which was labeled "Bedini Motor Generator first patent" in the web page I linked to. So this was not the same machine we are using, and it was running in cap discharge mode. John was not always clear in his explanations and sometimes used generalizations to make a point. I only referred to this link to point out several examples where John achieved way over unity with some of his machines. And he did talk about adding several batteries in parallel in EFTV either video part 24 or part 25 as I recall.

......................... In your post #10 you write about your radiant test, but the COP is not specified.

As best I recall, it takes my machine about double the time to recharge a battery in radiant than it does in common ground mode. But it also pulls less current from the primary in radiant mode as well. To replace 1 AH in the charge battery it takes about a full hour in radiant mode pulling about 1.25 amps from the input battery. This would be then 1AH/1.25 AH = .8 COP This is with an equal or larger size battery on the input.

No Drag
I probably didn't explain myself very well in this. What I was trying to do was compare the SSG in common ground mode to a conventional brush type motor driving a conventional, rectified alternator. In order to charge the battery conventionally with enough current to equal the performance of the SSG in CG mode would require a lot of input power from the drive motor. Then if you reduced the input motor current (i.e. voltage reduction) to the same as the SSG input current, the conventional motor would probably stall out.

talking about my machine (so no generator coils), in Radiant mode; as soon as the magnet passes its point closes to the coil, so starting to move away from the coil, the following two phenomenon cause drag on the rotor:
1-the discharging/releasing of the energy in the coil (Event C, see attachment)
2-induced current in trigger circuit (see attachment)
1-only diminishes I guess only because of the drop of voltage in the input battery over time
2-would only increase since the speed of the rotor increases…
So than my conclusion would be that the phenomena 1- weighs heavier than 2-, with a net effect of reduction in drag an thus increase of rotor speed.

We're talking about CG mode here, not radiant. And with either mode, I think the drag comes only from bearing friction, wind resistance, and a small amount from generatating the trigger coil current. In attraction mode the run current assists and causes the running of the machine, which is in opposition to any drag forces. The magnetic attraction of the permanent magnets due to the steel in the core is the same on approach as it is on escape for a net zero effect. Not sure how the coil collapse affects all this, but probably does in some way.

I think the point John was trying to make is that in CG mode (aka generator mode) fast battery charging (with both current and radiant energy combined) is equal to or better than using just generator coils with a conventional motor. A conventional motor/generator would require a lot more input current because of "drag" from Lenz's law working in both the motor and generator.

Batteries degrade in SG mode

John did say you can rotate batteries from charge to run position with no ill effects on the battery. It does charge mostly with current, but there is still a small radiant spike there that can be seen on an o-scope. If you stop charging at 15.3 volts and keep the electrolyte at the proper level, I think battery degradation would be very slow compared to using a "hot" charger.

Gary Hammond,