Question about the classic 4 pole kit

[Questor]

I attended a bedini-Lindemann conference up in Coer d'Alene ID a few years back, and I got the 3 pole kit shown in the pic attached. Only lately have I had time to try to get it to work. I lost my circuit diagram for it. So I have been using the circuit diagram that Jn Bedini posted in this forum. I believe I have it all hooked up right, but my wheel wont spin. Doesn't even make the "thump" sound when I plug in the primary battery. I removed the 2 slave coils, to simplify the circuit, to make it easier to see what I was doing wrong. From VOM measurements of voltage coming off the trigger coil, (.02) volts, I cant see how this is ever going to trip the transistor (which must get up to .6v base to bias the transistor. Could someone email me the original circuit diagram for this kit, or tell me that it is no longer supported, or doesn't work, and I will scrap it and start building a bicycle wheel large one coil, like the rest of you. Thanks, Frank.

OK, my camera wont take pics smaller than 300K. your web site seems to require jpg's to be no larger than 20k, so no pic is forthcoming.

anyway, it is clear plastic about 7 inches tall, and came w. a total of 4 coils all about the size of sewing machine thread coils. 26 gauge. the bifilar wound coil has 29 and 26 gauge wire in it. Has anyone gotten this kit to work? If you have, and you live in Nebraska or Kansas, I would be glad to drive over and we could troubleshoot it together.

[Nofear]

Hey Questor,
I remember my early days with that kit. And for the longest time I taught that something was wrong with my SG. Until I figured out that it is not a self starter and that you actually need to give it a serious kick before it goes on its own. Maybe you already know that...but I am mentioning it just in case it was never mentioned to you.
Good luck,
NoFear.

[BobZilla]

PM me your email address and I will give you the original papers for the machine.

https://files.secureserver.net/0sY656UjDDJYDP

You are talking about an R-Charge 3pole kit correct? ---Bob

[Dave Wing]

http://teep.forumco.com/pop_printer_...p?TOPIC_ID=894

I did a two second search on the net and came up with this thread, just scroll down and you will see the original circuit diagram.

It is fine to mess around with this 3 pole kit... But if you want real results, build a bike wheel according to the SSG BEGINNERS HANDBOOK and study the workings of the machine that way and waste less time.

Dave Wing

[aln]

Questor,
Just skip the grain of wheat bulb and switch and hook the trigger right up to the pot and give her a spin. The kit comes with the coils wound in repulsion mode, pull the magnets and put them south out or rewind the coils for a better charge. Ordered mine with 19awg power strands and still took a few days to charge a car battery. Good luck. If you haven't found the circuit yet post again and I'll find mine and scan it. Al

[Allen R.]

Hi Questor. I have that kit. Mine required the rotor to be very slightly clearanced at the center where the rotor meets the bearings. It almost would not run because of the pressure. Check yours to see if that is the issue. It only takes the tiniest bit of material removed to free up the rotor. I wouldnt ditch the switch and bulb as they cut your input considerably when properly adjusted. If indeed you have the clearance issue it will run easily with all the coils in (after being clearanced) . The original transistors will self-destruct easily so dont feel like youve done something wrong when they die. It was a common complaint with this kit that the circuit failed easily. I replaced with three 2n3055 transistors but something a little more space saving would look nicer. There is a thread on this forum about the kits using the wrong mags that you should look up. I would post a link but I'm not where I can at the moment. Hope to see your kit running soon.

al

[Questor]

Oh, yea, I've been spinning it. Both ways, fast and slow. Even hooked it up to an O-scope, and tried 3 diff VOM's. Spinning it is how I got the .02 volt reading on my VOM. Not quite sure what to ground my VOM to, when I take this measurement. I've tried red on one end of coil, black on other end of coil, that flutters at 0, .01 and .02 pos and neg. Then I tried grounding black lead of VOM to 9 volt battery neg terminal, (since that is relative ground in the whole circuit). Same voltage readings. Anyway, thanks so much for replying back. I cant believe the speedy replies and the number of people who responded. I am used to posting on Linux forums where it takes months for 1 person to get back to you. By the way, what kind of VOM readings do you get when you measure your trigger coil voltage and amps. If it isn't over .6V how does it ever trigger the transistor?

[Questor]

UM, mine actually has 4 coils. The trigger coil at bottom, and 3 slave coils around the top. But the plastic frame is identical. So I think we are talking about the same kit. Thanks MUCH for the pic. Yours looks very professional. I'm going to make mine look like that. What size transistors did U use, they look bigger than what came standard in the Kit. Were you ever able to charge batts with this kit? Is the big round disk in the center of the pic, just a flywheel for you to take RPM readings off of? If you have any zoomed in pics of the circuit board top and bottom I would really appreciate it.

[Brodie Gwilliam]

i had so much trouble getting it to run, you really have to spin it hard with no base resistance to get it to go(other than the 100 ohm base resistors), make sure your cores are pushed pretty close to the magnets too, i needed a flywheel to be able to spin it fast enough (was very hard to spin it fast just using the axle), 24v on primary side might make things easier too

[Branch Gordon]

I have this kit also, and experimented with it for awhile. I did get it running, however I never got great results from it. It comes with neo magnets, which John does not recommend. I have also heard that the coils are too small.

A photo of your build definitely would help. Can you upload a photo somewhere else and then post a link here? I usually upload mine to Google Drive, and then share from there.

What batteries are you using?

I attended a bedini-Lindemann conference up in Coer d'Alene ID a few years back, and I got the 3 pole kit shown in the pic attached. Only lately have I had time to try to get it to work. I lost my circuit diagram for it. So I have been using the circuit diagram that Jn Bedini posted in this forum. I believe I have it all hooked up right, but my wheel wont spin. Doesn't even make the "thump" sound when I plug in the primary battery. I removed the 2 slave coils, to simplify the circuit, to make it easier to see what I was doing wrong. From VOM measurements of voltage coming off the trigger coil, (.02) volts, I cant see how this is ever going to trip the transistor (which must get up to .6v base to bias the transistor. Could someone email me the original circuit diagram for this kit, or tell me that it is no longer supported, or doesn't work, and I will scrap it and start building a bicycle wheel large one coil, like the rest of you. Thanks, Frank.

OK, my camera wont take pics smaller than 300K. your web site seems to require jpg's to be no larger than 20k, so no pic is forthcoming.

anyway, it is clear plastic about 7 inches tall, and came w. a total of 4 coils all about the size of sewing machine thread coils. 26 gauge. the bifilar wound coil has 29 and 26 gauge wire in it. Has anyone gotten this kit to work? If you have, and you live in Nebraska or Kansas, I would be glad to drive over and we could troubleshoot it together.

[min2oly]

UM, mine actually has 4 coils. The trigger coil at bottom, and 3 slave coils around the top.

The coil at the top should be an extra generator coil.
Does it have thinner wire?
there should be master at the bottom and two slaves, like points on a perfect triangle.

[Allen R.]

Hi all. Here is a short video of mine running. I had taken it apart and was going to change the mags , clean it up , and build a proper circuit to replace the ugly one I built for it after the original died shortly after the conference. Wanted to see it running again so i out it back together as is a month or two ago. I have the extra gen coils and the wheel kit with cap dump but I dont have it hooked up. It works fine if you use small batteries. A real shame it wasn't built to John B's specs. I still love it anyway. Please excuse the ugly circuit https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t7-v...e_gdata_player

al

[Allen R.]

Min2oly is right. If it is like the kit in my video then the top coil is a gen coil , the bottom center is a bi-filler and the two on the sides should be single wire but larger gauge than the top coil. Those are your slave coils

al

The coil at the top should be an extra generator coil.
Does it have thinner wire?
there should be master at the bottom and two slaves, like points on a perfect triangle.

[Questor]

Just thought I'd give you all an update. I got the 3 coil kit self spinning for about an hour. Turns out I was not using my O-scope properly in my last post. Wasn't grounding it properly. Once I clipped the ground to the other end of the coil, I got a reading of plus and minus 2.5 volts, depending on how hard I spun the rotor. So that's plenty of voltage to trip the .6v base pin on the transistor. I simplified the circuit to just what Lindemann has drawn in his zip file that we can buy. I was a bit surprised when the rotor ran down after only one hour of running. Thought it was a fairly fresh 9 volt battery. I'll take some more measurements tomorrow. Just wondering, can anyone tell me of a good transistors for dummies guide that will tell me how to read a spec sheet on a transistor. I dont know what's important and what's not. I'd like to be able to swap in and out various sized transistors in my experiments, but I dont know which ones are compatible.