The SG Radiant Oscillator

[Gary Hammond]

Hi RS,

here is a PDF with a hand drawn current wave form like the one JB posted. hope the PDF works

I also added a Collector / Emitter Voltage wave form for clarification that is not on JB's pic
I would like to find the web page with this current wave form and review what JB was talking about where it is posted

That's pretty interesting!

Questions:

1. Does this only happen with an inductive load (coil)? How about with a majority resistive or capacitive load?

(Looks something like current lag in an inductor.)

2. Where is the current shunt located? Between emitter and ground? Between collector and coil/diode junction? Between coil and battery?

3. Is this the result of negative resistance in the barrier as holes and electrons migrate toward each other? Is this caused by a reverse avalanche phenomenon even though the collector is still positive compared to the emitter? Does this happen in both rotored and solid state modes?

4. In your drawing the time function begins at (I assume) the exact time the .6 volt barrier function is reached and the full supply voltage appears across the coil?

Sorry for all the questions. Just trying to figure out if this is due to inductive reactance, trigger current, or some other phenomenon.

[RS_]

1. Does this only happen with an inductive load (coil)? How about with a majority resistive or capacitive load?

I think only with inductive loads, (think Tesla and switching the long DC power lines), and current lagging the voltage happens when pos current flows, and is not the same thing as the neg current flow period

2. Where is the current shunt located? Between emitter and ground? Between collector and coil/diode junction? Between coil and battery?

current shunt is in the Neg power line as close to the transistor as ya can get.

And a edit: Also looking at a shunt between the Source and the coil will show you a different wave form....

3. Is this the result of negative resistance in the barrier as holes and electrons migrate toward each other? Is this caused by a reverse avalanche phenomenon even though the collector is still positive compared to the emitter?
I am not sure what causes it, but the faster the trigger turn on signal, the more pronounced the effect, and a really fast turn off helps too. and with full V across the coil, during that neg flow time period, what is happening...? (think Tesla and switching the long DC power lines)

Does this happen in both rotored and solid state modes?

Yes, but is more pronounced in the rotored versions, because the wave shape is very different from a SS version and why JB liked the rotored versions best, because otherwise, why bother with a rotor with moving parts machine...

4. In your drawing the time function begins at (I assume) the exact time the .6 volt barrier function is reached and the full supply voltage appears across the coil?

YES and the sharper and harder you can do this the better.... (Think Micro Wave level of switching speeds) where the Rotor's Magnetic Flip through the coil core, is Very fast like a snap that the trigger winding applys to the Base, and the Solid State models have a hard time replicating that wave form.....
Edit,
using a duel trace scope and Looking at a Linear Hall Effect Magnet field sensor on the coil, while looking at the Voltage and/or current wave forms at the same time, is quite illuminating as well. Having more than 1 scope is very helpful......

[min2oly]

1. Does this only happen with an inductive load (coil)? How about with a majority resistive or capacitive load?

I think only with inductive loads, (think Tesla and switching the long DC power lines), and current lagging the voltage happens when pos current flows, and is not the same thing as the neg current flow period

2. Where is the current shunt located? Between emitter and ground? Between collector and coil/diode junction? Between coil and battery?

current shunt is in the Neg power line as close to the transistor as ya can get.

3. Is this the result of negative resistance in the barrier as holes and electrons migrate toward each other? Is this caused by a reverse avalanche phenomenon even though the collector is still positive compared to the emitter?
I am not sure what causes it, but the faster the trigger turn on signal, the more pronounced the effect, and a really fast turn off helps too. and with full V across the coil, during that neg flow time period, what is happening...? (think Tesla and switching the long DC power lines)

Does this happen in both rotored and solid state modes?

Yes, but is more pronounced in the rotored versions, because the wave shape is very different from a SS version and why JB liked the rotored versions best, because otherwise, why bother with a rotor with moving parts machine...

4. In your drawing the time function begins at (I assume) the exact time the .6 volt barrier function is reached and the full supply voltage appears across the coil?

YES and the sharper and harder you can do this the better.... (Think Micro Wave level of switching speeds) where the Rotor's Magnetic Flip through the coil core, is Very fast like a snap that the trigger winding applys to the Base, and the Solid State models have a hard time replicating that wave form.....

I think I have shunt in wrong spot, just read this post...

[Dave Wing]

if we can find that one Pic JB has posted.... i can draw the wave form....

RS,

This may be what you are looking for?


Dave Wing

[RS_]

yes thank you

i have also seen another one from JB that looks closer to what i posted with a transistor, and is close to what i see on some units Shunts that i have studyed....

[min2oly]

Ok, now that I know where you want the shunt. Yes, this can almost only happen with a magnet passing the coil. Very good reason for it:

RS - what significance are you seeing with this?

[Faraday88]

here is a PDF with a hand drawn current wave form like the one JB posted. hope the PDF works

I also added a Collector / Emitter Voltage wave form for clarification that is not on JB's pic
I would like to find the web page with this current wave form and review what JB was talking about where it is posted

Hey guys,
Just my opinion...the pursuit for the 'Negative current' that is being discussed here is infact not 'current' at all in the first place!!! what does that tell us...? Yes, it is a part of the Radiant Electricity which is a CONVERTED VOLTAGE or better put it as a form of Voltage free of current or still better the form of the Voltage that is present in the bloch wall of a bar Magnet.. the whole point is to make THE MAGNET THE BATTERY THE COIL AND THE TRANSISTOR transperent or Resonant to one another.
In the solid-state, the same thing applies but is rather interpreted as intercepting the watsed Energy flow component which is the Heaviside flow and coincides with the bloch wall again of the coil.(a straight wire has an inverted bloch wall (outside its bulk)
Rgds,
Faraday88.

[Faraday88]

LessK,
Sorry for doing that but I want to show some things about Radiant Current, I have not received the SG bike wheel yet so I thought I would give a starter, sorry.
The SG circuits are all capable of dividing branch currents, after all we are just dealing with the spike which is Radiant. If everybody remembers my work from,
Kron, Gabriel. "...the missing concept of "open-paths" (the dual of "closed-paths") was discovered, in which currents could be made to flow in branches that lie between any set of two nodes. (Previously — following Maxwell — engineers tied all of their open-paths to a single datum-point, the 'ground'). That discovery of open-paths established a second rectangular transformation matrix... which created 'lamellar' currents..." "A network with the simultaneous presence of both closed and open paths was the answer to the author's years-long search." Gabriel Kron, "The Frustrating Search for a Geometrical Model of Electrodynamic Networks," Journal unk., issue unk., circa 1962, p. 111-128. The quote is from p. 114.

I'm just applying the Quote here in practice with the circuit, so you can see that if the coil was wound to take advantage of the currents what could be done.

I'm posting another video, hopefully that will explain what I'm doing.

@all,
I have attached here the correct circuit for the experiment that JB was referring to...the Single wire Potential shuttle actually implies to the Air-core Inductor and the split diode is tapped across it. This is the NODE 1 and the NODE 2 extends with Bridge and the Capacitor.
The Capacitor sits with a constant Voltage across it..while the 'CURRENT' represented by the electron/ion in the Battery is sucked. If you swapp the places of the Battery and the Capacitor you essentially have the Full Patent which charges the Battery because then you need to dump the Charge accumulated in the Capacitor into the battery with an Inverted Potential Switch as per the Patent 6,545.444
the original circuit for the Tesla Impulse technology is also attached.
Rgds,
Faraday88.

[Faraday88]

I'm not sure if you are referring to the trigger coil here or the power but neither has the bottom of the coil going to the negative rail. The power coil goes to the collector, and the trigger"s "bottom" is connected to the primary positive rail. The top of the trigger is going to the base of the transistor providing a positive signal to close the switch. This distinction is not so much relevant as is the purpose of the orientation.

Keep in mind that this is what commonly is called a "solid state" build although the bike wheel uses the same trick (think 2,3 4, triggers per magnet pass). In this patent and this embodiment the trigger is oriented in this fashion so that initially the primary positive flow activates the base of the transistor which closes the C/E junction of the transistor and allows current to flow through the power coil. The power coil builds a magnetic field. As the field gains strength it overcomes the triggers field via induction and cancels out/reverses the current which switches off the base opening the C/E junction. This would not happen if both trigger and power coils were oriented in the same direction, it would only increase and never open. That completes one cycle of operation now as the field of the power coil collapses the spike appears and is routed out the collector diode. As soon as the spike voltage is removed the cycle repeats, trigger pos to base, C/E closed, field grows, shuts trigger, field collapse, take spike, rinse and repeat. This is oscillation and it would not happen without the proper orientation of the trigger field and power field.

Faraday you are fixated on the trigger and that is not where the magic happens. I'm sorry bro but you need to get past this. You argued with me over on the toy thread about the same thing and I suspect you came here looking for "evidence" to try and throw back at me on that one and you thought you found a significance in a loose unattached trigger wire. I told you before that in fig one of the patent There is NO TRIGGER. Number 28 and number 36 are the same component. The reason for two numbers is to describe that 28 is a voltage generator and 36 is the coiled wire that makes it.

Imagine in a patent we have to describe joining two boards. It might say board A is joined to board B with a fastener(28), The fastener can be fashioned out of metal such as a nail (36). It could also be fashioned out of plastic as a screw (37).

Do you see that (28) is the fastener and (36) and (37) are descriptions of it? That is exactly what your mysterious number 36 is.

Now your asking about the .7v source. YES this circuit CAN so stop saying it couldn't. Don't confound the video Mr. Bedini showed with what the patent is describing. the 200uh coil is very tiny compared to what we play with and what he showed in the video about branch circuits. If you used a tiny coil as described the current from .7v is plenty to produce the high potential spike to charge a 12v battery. He was describing the tubes he built for low light solar in this instance. Don't you remember seeing the little oscillators that chuck built and showed running on crystal cells? If you understand these circuits you can build them in proper proportion to achieve whatever load you desire. The whole point of it is to get the high potential from a low potential.

One final note, this is about what Mr. Bedini was showing and your question about Kron etc..

He wanted us to learn open paths/branch circuits and I did, so did Patrick and many others. Anyone remember my old old thread on that SS I built utilizing this information ( no mattter but some of you do i"m sure)?

When you have multiple transistors instead of bussing the collector diodes together as everyone did prior to Mr. Bedini sharing this you put each circuit out to a load to be charged. This allows ALL that you have to share the high potential BUT charge on their own curve. As Mr. Bedini demonstrated with two dis-similar batteries you no longer had to worry about matching impedance. The circuit will gauge itself.

HeyBob/Min2oly,

Believe me,I did not read this earlier..but now today when was reading it all over again.. this is what found in the same thread here on John K stated although he admittedly spoofs about it!!) about the two Green wires

Quote Originally Posted by Howard Wetsman View Post
Les and John K,
I assume Les's question about trigger wire comes from John's video. It appears there are two litzed trigger wires as well as two litzed power wires. It is not clear to me if the trigger wires are split or they are attached to together to one end of both base resistors. I'm not even sure I can see two base resistors, but I'm assuming they are there. So if there's only one trigger, I'd wonder why it's made of two wires, and I've been assuming it has something to do with impedance which is not something I've been able to understand yet.
h
Les & Howard, look at the video John B posted in post #52 again. At about 1:22 into the video John says "1 trigger". Right at the end of the video you can see one of the green trigger wires connected to both of the base resistors.

There are two green wires, I'm guessing one of them is acting as a radiant antenna Haha, just kidding.

John K.

[Faraday88]

Patrick, does that mean that you are running this circuit in SS mode without the B-C resistor and the diode instead of the B-E resistor? Interesting.

What sort of results are you getting?

John K.

@All,
Recall JB saying the same to James Miller in the beginning of this thread... you can doit that way in the forced trigger..not with the Free running SS Oscillator as per the FEG book (with the bias resistors between C-B/CE).... Well, what if you could????
Rgds,
Faraday88.

[min2oly]

Can't let it go eh... hahaha.

If you put it on the bench you will see the difference between using one or two...

Yes, JB said "Split branches, one trigger" he did not say "one wire".

Sorry John K... but it is easy to miss on first glance...
Do a freeze frame you will see plainly two green wires twisted as they come out of the coil then for the last inch in perfect parallel making it difficult to see the one behind but plain as day when you look at the soldered area and even cleaner vid after 4 seconds...

Have fun my friends!

HeyBob/Min2oly,

Believe me,I did not read this earlier..but now today when was reading it all over again.. this is what found in the same thread here on John K stated although he admittedly spoofs about it!!) about the two Green wires

Quote Originally Posted by Howard Wetsman View Post
Les and John K,
I assume Les's question about trigger wire comes from John's video. It appears there are two litzed trigger wires as well as two litzed power wires. It is not clear to me if the trigger wires are split or they are attached to together to one end of both base resistors. I'm not even sure I can see two base resistors, but I'm assuming they are there. So if there's only one trigger, I'd wonder why it's made of two wires, and I've been assuming it has something to do with impedance which is not something I've been able to understand yet.
h
Les & Howard, look at the video John B posted in post #52 again. At about 1:22 into the video John says "1 trigger". Right at the end of the video you can see one of the green trigger wires connected to both of the base resistors.

There are two green wires, I'm guessing one of them is acting as a radiant antenna Haha, just kidding.

John K.[ATTACH=CONFIG]6670[/ATTACH]

[Faraday88]

Can't let it go eh... hahaha.

If you put it on the bench you will see the difference between using one or two...

Yes, JB said "Split branches, one trigger" he did not say "one wire".

Sorry John K... but it is easy to miss on first glance...
Do a freeze frame you will see plainly two green wires twisted as they come out of the coil then for the last inch in perfect parallel making it difficult to see the one behind but plain as day when you look at the soldered area and even cleaner vid after 4 seconds...

Have fun my friends!

Hey Min2oly,
JB did say 'one wire' but that did not imply to the trigger.. he meant to say about Tesla's 'One wire' shuttle circuit that he demonstrated in reply to James Miller's questions in the early post of this thread.
......Yes it will not reveal the difference unless the combo is 'Radiant treated'.. and this is where the Tesla's Impulse Technology come to play i have found out the same by experiments.
Please refer the diagram I posted on the flat pancake trifilar coil as applicable to the JB Patent 'Circuits and related methods'... look i have elaborated the need of the two trigger coils and what they mean.. In My experiments i have found that the start end of one trigger that goes to the base and the finish end of the OTHER going to the negative drives the oscillator..there is only capacitive coupling so to speak between the two, what does that tell you?
Think think think.... the battery charges like crazy when you acheive this!!!
Rgds,
Faraday88.

[min2oly]

Hey Min2oly,
JB did say 'one wire' but that did not imply to the trigger.. he meant to say about Tesla's 'One wire' shuttle circuit that he demonstrated in reply to James Miller's questions in the early post of this thread.
......Yes it will not reveal the difference unless the combo is 'Radiant treated'.. and this is where the Tesla's Impulse Technology come to play i have found out the same by experiments.
Please refer the diagram I posted on the flat pancake trifilar coil as applicable to the JB Patent 'Circuits and related methods'... look i have elaborated the need of the two trigger coils and what they mean.. In My experiments i have found that the start end of one trigger that goes to the base and the finish end of the OTHER going to the negative drives the oscillator..there is only capacitive coupling so to speak between the two, what does that tell you?
Think think think.... the battery charges like crazy when you acheive this!!!
Rgds,
Faraday88.

Do the experiment as I have stated and tell us what you find.

[Faraday88]

Do the experiment as I have stated and tell us what you find.

Hey Min2oly,

In the video JB did, he had the coil in the forced trigger mode which means the top two start ends of both the grees wire goes to the positive which is clearly seen to be the case,however i did the experiment in the free running mode oscillator (as in the FEG book) with bias resistors between C-B,B-E, and the base resitor ofcourse. now in this case, I did see a difference as you rightly pointed out , and that is when the top two ends are conneted together and this going to the base with the end of one of the wire let free does a faster and better charging also it charges from a battery whose voltage is as low as 2V !!.. another aspect is that protection Neon bulb glows with Pink orange glow a case different from normally seen colour of red-orange.
The third wire does indeed have a role to the Radiant conditioning of the coils and the assoicated components. how do you account for the difference between forced and free running modes??
Rgds,
Faraday88.

[min2oly]

You should see a difference using both setups you describe. The addition of a 2nd, 3rd... trigger winding is more basic than you describe. The accounting of effects you notice are perhaps a lucky tweak for your setup...
Why do you have 3 different winding sections on the coil?

Hey Min2oly,

In the video JB did, he had the coil in the forced trigger mode which means the top two start ends of both the grees wire goes to the positive which is clearly seen to be the case,however i did the experiment in the free running mode oscillator (as in the FEG book) with bias resistors between C-B,B-E, and the base resitor ofcourse. now in this case, I did see a difference as you rightly pointed out , and that is when the top two ends are conneted together and this going to the base with the end of one of the wire let free does a faster and better charging also it charges from a battery whose voltage is as low as 2V !!.. another aspect is that protection Neon bulb glows with Pink orange glow a case different from normally seen colour of red-orange.
The third wire does indeed have a role to the Radiant conditioning of the coils and the assoicated components. how do you account for the difference between forced and free running modes??
Rgds,
Faraday88.[ATTACH=CONFIG]6673[/ATTACH][ATTACH=CONFIG]6673[/ATTACH]